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Trump Won't Telegraph Strategy; U.S. May Have Interfered with Missile; China's Help with North Korea. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired April 18, 2017 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us. We begin with breaking news. The suspect in a callous and cold-blooded murder posted on Facebook has killed himself. The death of suspect Steve Stephens brings an end to an intense nationwide manhunt here in the United States.

Stephens was accused of gunning down Robert Godwin as Godwin was walking home from Easter Sunday dinner with his family. The Cleveland police chief tells how the search for Stephens ended.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CALVIN WILLIAMS, CHIEF, CLEVELAND POLICE DEPARTMENT: At approximately a little bit after 11:00 today, Pennsylvania state police officers received a tip that the vehicle that we were looking for, the white Ford Fusion, was in a McDonald's parking near Erie, PA. Those officers responded.

The vehicle fled from that area. There was a short pursuit in which the vehicle was stopped. As the officers approached that vehicle, Steve Stephens took his own life.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: The victim's daughter says she wishes the search had ended differently. Brenda Haymon tells CNN, I'm quoting her now, "all I can say is that I wish he had gone down in a hail of 100 bullets."

Our Correspondent Sara Ganim is joining us now live from Cleveland. Sara, what more can you tell us about how all of this unfolded?

SARA GANIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Police are telling us, Wolf, this all unfolded just after 11:00, just more than two hours ago. Someone called in a tip about that vehicle that has been broadcast across the country that they were looking for, that white Ford Fusion with temporary tags that they believed that Steve Stephens was driving.

Someone called in a tip that was in a McDonald's parking lot near Erie, Pennsylvania. A state trooper, a Pennsylvania state trooper, saw the vehicle. Followed it. Pursued it. Brief pursuit. Was able to pull the vehicle over near Buffalo Road and Downing Road in Erie County, Pennsylvania.

Shortly after Steve Stephens pulled over, authorities are telling us that he killed himself. A self-inflicted gunshot wound. He killed himself before he was approached by officers. Pennsylvania state police confirmed this in a tweet just before noon, saying that they had -- they had pulled the vehicle over and that Steve Stephens was dead.

And shortly after that, Cleveland police and authorities here, including the FBI and U.S. marshal's office, confirmed what the Pennsylvania State Police had tweeted out.

Now, we know that Erie Pennsylvania had been a focus of this investigation from the start. Shortly after the killing here in Cleveland of 74-year-old Robert Godwin, there was a ping detected from the suspect's cell phone the Erie police were investigating. A ping had been picked up and officers from Cleveland involved in the investigation along with the FBI, they went to Erie.

They searched the area. When that search turned up nothing, that search was essentially abandoned. But officers were -- today were headed back there to continue searching when all of this unfolded.

Now, the chief of police told us that, you know, this is an area that's very remote. A lot of places to hide. And that he -- you know, he said that it was one of those many tips that was followed up on that eventually led to the end of this manhunt.

Now, we had known from the beginning that Steve Stephens might be suicidal, that this might be the way that this ended. He had been posting on his Facebook rants about being suicidal, about telling his mother that. That's something that she also confirmed to CNN and the chief, in speaking to the community today, talked about the social media aspect of this and how that became a factor.

Take a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

I think everybody has learned from this. I think the people on social media kind of know the power and I think they know the harm it can do. So, we've talked before about people not living their lives on social media. And being truthful on social media and not harming people via social media. And, you know, this is a prime example. This is something that should not have been shared around the world. Period.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GANIM: Now, I am learning right now, Wolf, as we -- as you and I are speaking that they are looking for possible connections between the suspect and Erie, Pennsylvania. And one of the places that they are looking is the casino. We know that Steve Stephens talked about the casino here in Cleveland.

[13:05:05] He talked about gambling and losing everything. We know that court documents show he was having financial problems. That there were judgments against him. His wages were being garnished for nonpayment to landlords.

And I'm being told right now they're also looking at possible connections at the casino in Erie, Pennsylvania, whether or not he may have been frequenting that casino as well. So, they're looking at all possible connections to why this manhunt would have unfolded, would have ended in that location -- Wolf.

BLITZER: And, Sara, very quickly, the police chief said they're still continuing clearly the investigation. Is there any indication that during the three day this is guy was on the run he had any assistance, any help from anyone?

GANIM: There is no indication at this point. Of course, they have been looking into the people that he was talking to earlier today before this manhunt came to a conclusion. The police chief here said that they knew that he had been in contact with people. That they had talked to some of those people. Some of those people were family, some were friends.

They were urging others who may have had contact to come forward. There was some speculation by authorities that the fact that he had been on the run for this many days without any detection, no license plate was picked up, no additional pings from that cell phone that they believed that there was a possibility that he was being aided.

But there is no evidence to show that he was being harbored in any way. That, at this point, that's just something that they're looking into. That they have no -- they have no evidence, at this point -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right. Sara Ganim on the scene for us in Cleveland, Ohio. Let's bring in our panel, our Law Enforcement Analyst Art Roderick and Cedric Alexander and CNN National Correspondent Deb Feyerick.

Art, so walk us through this investigation. The suspect killed himself in this -- in this last few moments with the state police in Erie, Pennsylvania. So, what happens now?

ART RODERICK, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, I think nobody is surprised, in law enforcement circles, that he did end up killing himself. It was almost like the video was his final -- the posting of the video and the killing of Mr. Godwin was going to be his final big issue.

Now, he threatened to kill other people afterwards and I think that was the tense part of this whole law enforcement search. It's interesting that we're referencing the casino in Erie, Pennsylvania. That actually would be a pretty good place to hide out for a few days.

BLITZER: Why would that be high?

RODERICK: Well, they're open for 24 hours. The only issue I see here is that casinos have some of the best surveillance video going in this country. So, if he was in there, if he was gaming, if he was just hiding out in there, there'll be plenty of video of him doing that. It's just odd -- if that's the only connection he has to Erie, was he sleeping in his car, was he hiding out in one of the areas? You know, did he break into a cabin or hide out there? This is a very rural area and that is a distinct possibility.

BLITZER: Cedric, you're not surprised at all this ends with his committing suicide.

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: No, I'm not surprised at all. And, typically, in these types of situations, we have seen this. I had somewhat predicted this along with many other law enforcement officials across the country. So, I'm not surprised at all, Wolf.

But I think the important piece is at this point going forward is to really try to make sense out of where did this all come from? What happened to him over some course of period of time that led him up to this type of violent and heinous act in killing Mr. Godwin who was totally unknown to him and just an innocent man?

So, hopefully a deep dive is taken into some of his social and psycho social history so we can maybe garner or learn something as to what was in the mind of Mr. Stephens --

BLITZER: All right.

ALEXANDER: before he killed this man and took his own life.

BLITZER: Hold on for a moment. The Facebook CEO, Mark Zuckerberg, is speaking at a conference in San Jose, California. He's addressing the video that Steve Stephens posted on Facebook that showed Stephens killing a complete stranger. The 74-year-old grandfather who was simply walking down the street.

Let's listen in to see what he said just moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK ZUCKERBERG, CEO, FACEBOOK: And we have a lot more to do here. And we're reminded of this this week by the tragedy in Cleveland. And our hearts go out to the family and friends of Robert Godwin, Sr. And we have a lot of work and we will keep doing all we can to prevent tragedies like this from happening.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Mark Zuckerberg, the CEO of Facebook, speaking about the Facebook connection to this murder. Deb Feyerick, it's so, so sad to know that apparently just randomly this individual goes up to this grandfather, shoots him and then posts the video online, blames his ex-girlfriend for all of this.

[13:10:10] There are lessons in social media that everyone has to learn from this including Zuckerberg.

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, yes, there's absolutely no question about that. As a matter of fact, the chief of police there in Cleveland said people have to learn to not live online. And this kind of material should not be put on Facebook or not have people to not have access.

It is traumatizing to see this and to think that it's OK. We think back to that reporter who was killed in Virginia not long ago. The killer wanted to call attention to himself. He wasn't just angry at his girlfriend, though he blames her outright for driving him essentially to do this.

He's also very angry at his mother as well. And the day before this happened, he actually went to his mother's house and he told her, according to his rant on Facebook, that, in fact, he was suicidal and that he was going to go out and kill somebody and kill people.

He says she didn't do anything. She didn't care. And you feel this anger welling up inside of him which is surprising given that he was basically a youth mentor and worked in a place where he was trying to guide young kids to do the right thing.

So, how that happened, it's unclear. But the investigation, and the chief of police in Cleveland made this very clear, is very much ongoing. This is not over. They've got to go. They've got to look at the car. They've got to see what receipts may be inside that car. Where he was. Trace back where he may have stayed. It's a big area. There are farms. There are barns.

You know, they want to, sort of, close the loop on this and make sure he didn't hurt anybody else. That's what they were really afraid about. Because initially he said he'd killed other people. He even gives locations of places where he allegedly killed people before shooting Mr. Godwin.

Their concern and their fear was that in this time on the run, two days, from Sunday at 2:00 to just this morning, that maybe he would've interacted with other people and caused greater damage. It doesn't look like he did.

Four hundred tips came in. One of those tips proving vital. He was in the McDonald's parking lot. He drove about two miles, according to one of our reporter on scene. Two miles and that's when he pulled over and killed himself as police, apparently, approached. But he did not fire at them. It doesn't seem he fired at anybody else. But you've really got to look aback and make sure that that is, in fact, the case.

The pay -- you've been talking --

BLITZER: You know, Art --

FEYERICK: Yes, go ahead.

BLITZER: I was just going to ask Art, the Pennsylvania State Police said, Art, they use they call a pit maneuver to stop him and to capture him.

Explain what a pit maneuver is.

RODERICK: Yes, a pit maneuver is a fairly common technique used in law enforcement when a vehicle won't stop when a law enforcement officer puts his red or blue lights on in the vehicle and you're in a pursuit with that particular vehicle. It's a maneuver that's trained. You have to train to be able to know how to do it.

A lot of the vehicles now you see have these extended bumpers from law enforcement. And, basically, what you do is you approach the rear of the vehicle, generally the driver's side, bumper. And with your front bumper on the passenger side and try to just tap the vehicle to get it into a spin so that you can get the vehicle to stop. It's used all over the country. It's used a lot in vehicle pursuits. And it does work. It is a very useful technique.

BLITZER: Well, it was affective in this particular case.

RODERICK: Yes, exactly.

BLITZER: Unfortunately, this is over with right now. But there's still a lot -- people want to learn. They want to learn lessons from this as well, especially the social media aspect of this to try to make sure it doesn't happen again.

RODERICK: And we have time now.

BLITZER: Yes.

RODERICK: The tense manhunt portion is over so now they can piece all this together, at this point in time.

BLITZER: All right. Art Roderick, thanks very much. Cedric, thanks to you. Deb Feyerick, thanks as well.

Up next, the new threats from North Korea over their arsenal of missiles as the Trump administration keeps quiet about the next step. We're going to have new details.

And speak with the ranking member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, Senator Ben Cardin. There you see him. He's standing by live. Lots to discuss.

Then later, President Trump heading to the Midwest to top his plan to hire American and buy American, a new executive order. But is there a true focus of the plan? We're going to examine that and a lot more.

Stay with us.

[13:14:26]

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[13:18:14] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: We're now hearing new threats from North Korea. In an interview, a senior North Korean official says the country could hold weekly missile tests and promises all-out war if the United States takes any military action. It's a reaction to the more aggressive tone we've been hearing from President Trump and Vice President Mike Pence.

President Trump is aboard Air Force One right now on his way to Wisconsin where he'll deliver his jobs message and sign an executive order on his hire American/buy American agenda. But President Trump is also talking today about North Korea and his strategy of secrecy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If you look at different things over the years with President Obama, everybody has been outplayed. They've all been outplayed by this gentleman. And we'll see what happens. But I just don't telegraph my moves.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did we sabotage the North Korea strike?

TRUMP: I don't want to comment on it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. What happens if North Korea launches another missile?

TRUMP: We'll find out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Vice President Pence, meanwhile, is continuing his swing through Asia today with events in Japan. He was in South Korea yesterday. Today he talked to the Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe about the need for the United States and Asian allies to stick together and keep up the pressure on North Korea.

And in an exclusive interview with our own Dana Bash, who's traveling with the vice president in Japan this morning, the vice president echoed the president's take on a nuclear North Korea.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: As the president says, it's time for them to behave, to listen to the world community, and to set aside their nuclear ambitions, their ballistic missile ambitions, and be willing to join the family of nations. And it - for my part, in some odd way, it's encouraging that they're getting the message. And my hope is that they'll continue to get the message, not just from the United States and here in Japan and in South Korea, but on an increasing basis from China and countries all over the world that long ago committed to a denuclearized Korean peninsula.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[13:20:22] BLITZER: Joining us now from Baltimore, Democratic Senator Ben Cardin. He's the ranking member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Senator, thanks for joining us.

SEN. BEN CARDIN (D), RANKING MEMBER, FOREIGN RELATIONS CMTE.: Wolf, it's good to be with you. Thank you. BLITZER: The president says he won't telegraph his strategy on North Korea, but has Congress - and you're the ranking Democrat on the Foreign Relations Committee, have you been briefed on what that emerging strategy is all about?

CARDIN: I'm not aware of anyone in Congress being briefed. And I agree with the president, we don't telegraph our moves. But it's extremely important that we have a strategy. And that strategy is shared with the Congress. And he has not done that. It raises questions as to whether we really do have a strategy in regards to North Korea or are we're just reacting to the current situation.

The young leader of North Korea is extremely dangerous. Make no mistake about it. You see how he takes out members of his own family. So we cannot assume that he'll make rational moves. That requires the United States to exercise global leadership on this issue.

BLITZER: In an interview with the BBC, a senior North Korean official now says the country could conduct what he described as weekly missile tests and promises all-out war if provoked by the U.S. What's your response to those very specific threats from the North Koreans?

CARDIN: Well, our goal needs to be to change the equation for North Korea. We have to change their way of thinking so they recognize that entering into an arrangement is their best way forward. The way to do that is to really isolate North Korea. And that means China. China has to stop helping their economy. I don't know the results of the bilateral meeting between the two leaders, China and the United States, but I do know that China can play a much more important role in convincing the North Koreans it's in their interest to give up their nuclear weapon program.

BLITZER: As you know, the North Koreans had a failed missile test over the weekend. President Trump refused to comment on whether the U.S. had a hand in forcing that failure, possibly using cyber capabilities or jamming communications. Can you shed any light at all on this? As you know, there's been a lot of speculation out there.

CARDIN: I don't know. I don't have the specifics because I have not been briefed on the specifics. I do know that North Korea's previous attempts, that there have nowhere near the technology that we have or other countries have on missile technology, so it's not surprising that some of their tests fail. We don't know whether it's just because of their lack of technology and their lack of experience, but we do know that they are trying to perfect a long range missile which could be extremely dangerous to the United States national security. So it's something we have to pay close attention to.

BLITZER: Especially if they can put a nuclear warhead on that missile, which they're clearly trying to achieve as well.

And referring to China, you just mentioned it. As you know, the president, in recent days, since his meeting with the Chinese president, Xi, he's changed his tone rather dramatically. He's treating them with much greater respect. This, he points out, because he now believes that China will play an important role in trying to ease tensions or reduce the North Korean threat. The Chinese have a lot of influence on North Korea. Do you believe that he's moving in the right direction?

CARDIN: I believe that we have to be very straight with China. We can do more than one subject at the same time. It's in China's interest to reduce the nuclear threat on the Korean Peninsula. So we have a common interest in North Korea.

But we also have concerns about China on trade. We have concerns about China on the China Seas. We have concerns about China on human rights issues. And I don't think we're doing our bilateral relationship any favor if we don't be very direct and straightforward on our concerns on all of these fronts.

So, no, I was not satisfied because I didn't hear much about these other issues. And China will ultimately do what they believe is in their best interest in regards to North Korea. We've got to make that calculation more favorable towards our - what we're trying to achieve, and that is to remove North Korea as a nuclear threat.

BLITZER: While I have you, senator, a quick reaction. As you know, there was a victory for the Turkish president, Erdogan, in that referendum, giving him a lot more power. The State Department says there were some irregularities in the vote, some concerns being expressed about how it all unfolded. But President Trump went ahead and he called Erdogan congratulating him, not raising any of those concerns. Do you believe that was appropriate?

[13:25:00] CARDIN: Well, Turkey's our NATO ally. Turkey is a vibrant democracy. It's up to the Turkish people to determine how their government will be formed. They had a referendum. The referendum, according to what was announced, passed by a slight margin. It does consolidate power with Mr. Erdogan. There's many concerns about how that power is being consolidated. And there's been international concerns raised about the integrity of the election. I think it's important that there be an independent, fair evaluation of these concerns and I would urge the Turkish government, Mr. Erdogan, to follow-up with a transparent review of what these concerns have been about.

BLITZER: Senator Cardin, thanks for joining us.

CARDIN: My pleasure. Thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: The vice president, Mike Pence, says North Korea seems to be getting the message on its nuclear program, but is it enough to dial back the escalating nuclear tensions on the Korean Peninsula? I'll speak with Republican Congressman Adam Kinzinger. He's a member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee. He served in Iraq and Afghanistan. And we'll talk about that and about the two Russian bombers intercepted off the coast of Alaska just a little while ago. We have details.

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