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Trump Picks Tillerson For Secretary Of State; Delay In Trump News Conference; Trump Disputes CIA Findings On Russia Hacking; Intel Community Thinks GOP Was Hacked; Trump Picks Exxon CEO for State; Tillerson's Russia Ties Raise Concerns. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired December 13, 2016 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 1:00 p.m. here in Washington, 8:00 p.m. in Aleppo, Syria, 9:00 p.m. in Moscow. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

We start with President-elect Donald Trump making his pick for secretary of state. As expected, he settled on Rex Tillerson, the CEO of ExxonMobil.

Tillerson has no government foreign policy experience but has done lots of business with countries and leaders around the world.

He also has a very good relationship with the Russian president, Vladimir Putin. The Russian foreign minister, Sergey Lavrov, says his country welcomes the choice of Tillerson.

We also heard praise from the Senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, who said, I'm quoting him now, "Rex Tillerson's decades of experience have been widely recognized for focus leadership around the globe. I look forward to supporting his nomination."

And then, there was Vice President-elect Mike Pence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: We just couldn't be more grateful that someone of Rex Tillerson's proven leadership and accomplishments have been willing to step forward to serve our nation as our next secretary of state.

(ENDE VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: We've also heard that Donald Trump has made his choice for energy secretary. The former Texas governor, Rick Perry.

Back in the 2012 presidential campaign, Perry famously forgot the name of the energy department, when naming the three government agencies he wanted to shut down.

Later today, the president-elect will leave New York for Wisconsin for his next stop on his thank you tour.

The vice president Mike Pence, vice president-elect, I should say, and the House speaker, Paul Ryan, they are both expected to be in Wisconsin with the president-elect.

Let's bring in our Phil Mattingly. He's over at Trump Tower in New York City. Our Senior Political Reporter Manu Raju is joining us and our CNN Global Affairs Correspondent Elise Labott.

Phil, how did Rex Tillerson rise so quickly, apparently very quickly? He wasn't even mentioned until a week or two ago.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes, that's exactly right. And it was largely on the backs of recommendations behind the scenes, Wolf.

Trump transition officials saying it was three individuals specifically, James Baker, Condoleezza Rice and Bob Gates. Obviously, three pillars of the GOP foreign policy establishment. Three former cabinet secretaries themselves, all of whom recommended Rex Tillerson for this position.

The president-elect had never actually met Rex Tillerson before this process all started. Because of their recommendations, he was willing to sit down with him.

He found that they shared similar world views. That they were very comfortable with one another. And that he was willing to select Rex Tillerson above all of the other candidates that we've seen up to this point, Wolf.

Obviously, this is a big pick we've all been waiting for. But I will note, as you said, a lot of comings and goings at Trump Tower today. Rick Perry, sources say, expected to be announced as energy secretary.

Also, Bill Gates here. And we we're told he was meeting with the president-elect about was research and development, trying to push that forward.

Also, Wolf, a rather random visitor. Kanye West decided to stop by. Had a 15-minute meeting, sit down with the president-elect to talk about life, according to the president-elect.

But all the focus, really, on the cabinet selections and, obviously most notably, Rex Tillerson -- Wolf.

BLITZER: You're also getting some new information, Phil, on the news conference that has now been delayed. It was supposed to be Thursday, during which the president-elect would announce how he's going to split up his business so that there's no conflict of interest, if you -- if you will.

It's now been delayed until January. What are you learning?

MATTINGLY: Well, we know this. Obviously, the president-elect made a big deal about this announcement. That is apparently never going to come. At least not in the year of 2016.

What he tweeted last night, going onto Twitter, trying to address some of these issues. Saying he would stop all new deals going forward and he would find a legal structure to hand the business down to his son, Eric and Donald Jr.

Now, Ivanka Trump was not listed as somebody who would be handed the business. She is expected to be phased out as she and her husband plan to move down to D.C. and serve in advisories roles.

But I'm also told that there are difficulties in how this process is trying to move forward.

And the reality is this. The president-elect has said repeatedly, Wolf, that he legally doesn't have to separate from the business at all, so anything that he's willing to do to take himself operationally out should be considered a good thing.

But I'm told advisers inside his team are wary of not going far enough. They are cognizant, Wolf, the fact that this will be problematic for the president-elect, for his team, not in just the first hundred days, not the first couple months, but perhaps for years, if they don't address this and go far enough from the very beginning.

Why this was delayed? They simply weren't ready. These debates internally are still playing out going forward, as the lawyers try and figure out the proper legal structure to actually put this in place -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, new reporting from Phil. Thanks very much.

Manu, there's already some concern being expressed in the Senate. The Senate's going to have to confirm Rex Tillerson as the secretary of state. It first goes to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

[13:05:00] Marco Rubio, a Republican, he said this in a statement. And I'll put it up on the screen. While Rex Tillerson is a respected businessman, I have serious concerns about his nomination. The next secretary of state must be someone who views the world with moral clarity, is free of potential conflicts of interest. I look forward to learning more about his record and his views.

I will do my part to ensure he receives a full and fair but also thorough hearing before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Specifically, there's some questions, not just from Democrats but a few Republicans, about his dealings, his connections with Putin and Russia. What are you hearing?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes, that's exactly what he's going to have to answer in these confirmation hearings.

You know, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee is going to have a one-vote margin, 10 to nine panel. That means if one Republican were to defect, like a Marco Rubio, he could be enough to stall the nomination and potentially derail the nomination as well, assuming that Democrats are united against him.

Now, I just got off the phone, Wolf, with Bob Corker, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee chairman, who was actually passed over for the state department job. And Corker was very positive about Tillerson. He said he's the very best choice for Donald Trump.

But he acknowledged not really knowing what Tillerson's world views are on Russia. They have not spoken about it in depth. And he said that he's got a lot of questions to answer on that very topic.

And on a separate but related matter, Corker also told me that his committee is going to launch an investigation, more hearings into the issue of Russia hacking. And that's something that the Foreign Relations Committee has not done yet.

It's something that the Armed Services Committee and the Intelligence Committees said they would do. But Corker is saying that he would be the third panel to look into that issue come January.

So, obviously, that Russia issue looming over Tillerson's nomination but also, of course, the hacking looming over Congress as well.

BLITZER: So, if they're going to have a committee, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, the Armed Services Committee, the Intelligence, why not just have a select panel, if you will, bring all of these resources together, instead of duplicating all of these investigations?

RAJU: I think that's what Democrats want. They want something like the Benghazi Committee that went after Hillary Clinton or 911 commission. But Republicans have been resistant to that. Particularly the Republican leadership, Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan, because it could get out of control.

It could be politically problematic for Donald Trump. And that they can -- it's much more -- it's much easier when you do it to the standing legislative committees.

Then, you have more control over the process and people they trust, like a Bob Corker or a John McCain, for instance, dealing with it, rather than a more unwieldly process by a stand-alone committee.

BLITZER: Interesting and good reporting on your part as well.

Elise, pressure is on you for some good reporting. What are you hearing --

RAJU: As always.

BLITZER: -- from the diplomatic community, if you will? Rex Tillerson about to be formally nominated as the next secretary of state.

ELISE LABOTT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, I've talked to a lot of career diplomats. And, you know, look, there is a lot of wariness about Tillerson's ties to Russia.

And that, I think, plays into larger fears about what U.S. policy in Russia is going to be. Is it going to be more accommodating to Russia in some serious areas of disagreement? In Ukraine, in Syria, in some of the election meddling that they've been doing through Eastern Europe.

So, there are those concerns and also some of his other business dealings in Kyrgyzstan, for instance. When they were exploring oil there, that was done, kind of, against the wishes of the U.S. government who wanted them to deal with the government in Baghdad.

He's going to have to pivot now to be America's top diplomat. And I think while there is this wariness, there's also a little bit of excitement about a diplomat coming in with a new approach, hard-nosed negotiator who could have a little bit more success.

So, I think there's willing to be a little bit more of an open mind and giving him a chance. I think there is some excitement among the career foreign service that he could have a new approach.

BLITZER: What about all these reports out there that perhaps John Bolton, a former U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, who also served in the State Department during the Bush administration, could be named deputy secretary? The number two person at the State Department. What are you hearing about the reaction to that?

LABOTT: And also, he was -- he was a U.S. ambassador to the U.N. That was a very controversial recess appointment.

I mean, John Bolton has a very complicated history with the State Department. He's been very controversial about the foreign service, about career diplomats.

And so, there is a little -- there's a lot of, frankly, anxiety about John Bolton in career services.

But there is also -- there are people that think that he has been also a very good negotiator on behalf of President Bush's proliferation agenda. He negotiated a hundred separate agreements on the ICC with other countries.

I think that if it is Tillerson and Bolton, John Bolton is really the deputy, the main management position in the State Department.

If Rex Tillerson doesn't have any government experience, that really gives John Bolton a lot of power to shape what's going on at the State Department.

And I think, for some people that do follow John Bolton's kind of more extreme right-wing view, anti-Russia, anti-Iran, anti-multilateral (ph) organizations, that could be a good thing.

[13:10:03] BLITZER: He doesn't have that nomination yet, John Bolton. Let's see if the president-elect decides to go that route.

Very quickly.

RAJU: And if he does go that route, expect that to become a huge --

LABOTT: Yes.

RAJU: -- battle on the Hill. You talked to Rand Paul about possibly Bolton becoming the secretary of state.

BLITZER: Yes.

RAJU: He was opposed to that.

BLITZER: All right.

RAJU: If he's going to fight that, he'll fight him to be secretary as well.

LABOTT: Then there will be two bruising confirmation battles at State.

BLITZER: Let's get some more on all of this. Joining us now, Sean Spicer. He's on the Republican National Committee. He's the chief of communications advisor, chief strategist. He's a senior advisor to the president-elect right now.

Sean, thanks very much for joining us.

SEAN SPICER, CHIEF STRATEGIST, RNC: Good afternoon, Wolf. Thanks for having me.

BLITZER: So, why did the president-elect choose the ExxonMobil CEO, Rex Tillerson, to become the nation's next secretary of state?

SPICER: Oh, because he's a world-class business leader that has connections throughout the globe. He has been unbelievably successful. And I think, as you just noted, he's a tough negotiator by everybody's standard.

He's somebody that can implement a Trump agenda around the world, re- establish America's place around the world and get things done. That's what Donald Trump has looked for in all of his picks. Are successful people to get the job done.

I think Rex Tillerson, by all accounts, is somebody that's going to get that -- that's going to do that.

You've seen people like Bob Gates, Condi Rice, Stephen Hadley, very, very top-notch folks and folks on the Hill. Senator Ron Johnson, Speaker Paul Ryan, Sarah McConnell, others, praise this pick because they realize this is a (INAUDIBLE) that can get things done for this country.

BLITZER: On the other hand, listen to Republican Senator John McCain. Listen to what he told our Jake Tapper on "THE LEAD" yesterday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: This guy is a thug and a murder and I don't see how anybody could be a friend of this old-time KGB agent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: He was referring to Vladimir Putin who apparently has a pretty good relationship with Mr. Tillerson. How do you respond to the critics saying he's too close to Russia?

SPICER: Well, it's not a -- I mean, I think, frankly, if we want to get things done in Russia, we need somebody who has a relationship not just with Putin but from other world leaders. That's how things get done.

It's not just tough talk and rhetoric. When people have a relationship and could put -- and can put America's interests first and foremost to achieve our interests.

I mean so -- I think, if the -- if the hit against Rex Tillerson is that he has a relationship with people like Putin and other world leaders and is able to get things done.

But, again, you look at Exxon. There's no question that he's been highly successful. He's, by all accounts, a tough negotiator.

And, yes, he's got relationships. I think that's what we want out of the next secretary of state. Somebody who's going to go re-establish our interests around the globe, stand up to world leaders, put America's interests first and achieve great things.

That's why Donald Trump picked him. That's why he'll be confirmed. And that's why he'll do a great job as our next secretary of state.

BLITZER: Do you think that John Bolton will be the deputy secretary of state?

SPICER: Well, one thing I've learned around here is the only person who makes those decisions is Donald Trump. It'll be up to him to decide who that deputy secretary will be, as well as other high- ranking positions within the State Department and throughout the government.

BLITZER: I want to just see if you can -- you can clarify because I know it's been a big issue in recent days. The CIA, the intelligence community, the FBI, they all agree the Russians hacked Democratic institutions, the DNC, John Podesta's e-mail account, the chairman of the Hillary Clinton campaign.

They disagree on what the purpose, the motive was. The intelligence community thinks it was trying to help Trump get elected president. The FBI disagrees. They think they were just trying to meddle and cause some mischief.

But there also seems to be an emerging consensus that while they -- the Republicans didn't hack the Republican National Committee, they did hack Republican institutions and political operatives. What can you tell us about that?

SPICER: Well, what I can tell you is that we've got a lot of unnamed sources making accusations.

And I think that one of the things that we were presented last Friday night was several media institutions coming to us and saying that the conclusions that the intelligence agencies that we are talking to, or at least the sources, conclude that because they hacked both the RNC and the DNC, we have come -- they have concluded that, therefore, Russia did the following.

And our pushback was, well, we have conclusive proof that they didn't hack us. Therefore, the predicate is wrong, therefore the conclusion should be called into question. That's it, plain and simple.

I think that what we've had is a lot of people citing unnamed sources from unnamed agencies, making it seem as though those are credible outcomes.

What we need is more credible understanding of what actually happened and more concrete disclosures of what agencies think exactly what and why.

But, right now, we have a lot of folks in the media running around trying to make accusations as to what they think their sources claim have happened. And, yet, there's no concrete proof to actually show that any of those conclusions are based in sound practice.

BLITZER: So, you agree with the FBI that, yes, the Russians hacked. But it was not designed necessarily to get Trump elected? It was designed to muddy the waters, if you will, embarrass the United States? Is that what I'm hearing?

[13:15:00] SPICER: No, because what I think we throw around this word "hacked." And I think that there's a difference between what the forensic folks talk about probing, trying to see what's out there, trying to figure out if they can find an entrance point. That's called probing. Hacking is actually achieving the means by getting inside of an organization or getting inside of a computer system to -- to extract data. So in some cases it's just merely probing around. I think that's what's, you know, hackers do that. Other countries do that. Other organizations do that. And I think what we have is a lot of rumor about different organizations potentially doing it and who may be behind those organizations. I think there's further investigation that needs to be done, but there needs to be a lot less speculation and a lot more fact.

BLITZER: So you want these investigations to go forward in the House and the Senate as Mitch McConnell, the majority leader in the Senate, and others have called for. But let me be precise on this because it's (INAUDIBLE) --

SPICER: Well, but hold on, Wolf, one --

BLITZER: Yes.

SPICER: One delineation. One, I think -- I think this is -- there's a difference between the integrity of our voting system, right? I -- I agree. Donald Trump agrees. Everybody, I think, all Americans would agree that we don't want any entity, foreign or otherwise, getting involved in our election system and trying to either interfere in any way, whether it's trying to change the outcome or otherwise.

But there's another piece of this, which is left-wing groups and frankly some in the media who are trying to delegitimize Donald Trump's resounding win on November 8th. And I think that's some point for all of the talk that occurred prior to November 8th, to hear these folks and you hear a lot of the folks frankly on the Hillary Clinton who have yet to get over the fact that they lost and they lost big is upsetting because it was -- it was our side that was getting questioned of whether we would accept the results of these elections, whether we believed in the integrity of the election system. And now that we -- Donald Trump won big, 306 electoral votes, 2,300 counties, 62 million votes, it is now everyone coming back to us and saying, well, we've got these unnamed sources and we believe the following.

BLITZER: All right.

SPICER: But the fact of the matter is, is that we should all agree in the same way that we agree that no one should interfere with our elections. We should equally agree that Donald Trump won resoundingly by the rules of the game that were established. He will be the next president and we should want to ensure that we have integrity in our democracy as well.

BLITZER: But -- but do -- you agree -- I assume you agree, that, if, in fact, the Russians hacked, and whatever you want to use, whatever word you want to use, there are important lessons to be learned and a full review should be done by the various congressional committees, as well as by the U.S. intelligence community and the law enforcement community. You support that kind of review?

SPICER: Sure. But I also think -- absolutely. But I -- but let's take it back a step. I believe that institutions, whether they be government or private, should be putting proper protocols in place to ensure that they have the highest integrity in their own systems first and foremost. Secondly, sure, I believe that we should ensure that no entities are looking into either attacking our own government or our institutions that are achieving to -- to abide -- be involved in the electoral process.

But I think that this -- that's vastly different than whether or not there was a difference in the outcome of the election. This is a -- there were some disclosures about e-mails that, frankly, the other piece of this is not getting talked to. The only reason that we're talking about some of this is because John Podesta and Neera Tanden and others on the left said some things in e-mails that they wished didn't come out. If they hadn't behaved the way that they did, then none of this would have happened. They wrote those e-mails. They're the ones who had a secret server. They're the ones who didn't put proper protocols in place. And I don't, by any means, I also, you know, I'm not disqualifying the second piece of this. But I think that we've got to -- we keep forgetting in this discussion that it was them who had a secret server, it was them who didn't abide by the rules and regulations that had been set by the government and by the State Department to ensure --

BLITZER: All right.

SPICER: That some of this kind of stuff wouldn't happen. And that's been lost in this discussion. BLITZER: I know you've got to go, but one quick question, I just want

to button this up about hacking of Republican institutions. Mike McCall, the chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee, he told me back in September on my show that the RNC had been hacked. He later corrected that. He said, "I misspoke by asserting that the RNC was hacked. What I had intended to say was that in addition to the DNC hack, Republican political operatives have also been hacked." A two- pronged question, which Republican political operatives were hacked and why wasn't that information released?

SPICER: Well, one, it's not my job to speak for anybody but the Republican National Committee at that time. And my job was to ensure that people understood that we had taken certain protocols, put things in place and that we hadn't been hacked. So that was my only concern at that time. I'll have to let others speak for themselves and, frankly, it's not my job, nor is it anyone else's, to speak for other organizations or other individuals in terms of whether they may or may not be hacked.

One of the things that's important to understand is, when you have even this discussion that you or I are having, it's basically an invitation to folks and we've got to make sure that we understand that those kind of just discussions have implications for people in terms of the security of their networks.

BLITZER: All right, we'll leave it on that note, Sean, but we'll continue this conversation down the road, I'm sure. Thanks so much for joining us.

SPICER: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Coming up, as Trump fills out his cabinet, what's next for Trump loyalists, like the former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani and Governor Chris Christie? We'll discuss that.

[13:20:07] Plus, a compete meltdown of humanity. That's how the United nations is describing the growing crisis inside Aleppo, Syria. Reports there are mass executions and children pinned down by heavy artillery fire. We're going live to the region.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: President-elect Donald Trump makes two more cabinet choices, a former oil state governor and presidential candidate is his pick to lead the Department of Energy. And Trump has chosen an oil company's CEO to be the next secretary of state.

Let's bring in our panel. CNN political commentator Ryan Lizza. He's the Washington correspondent for "The New Yorker" magazine. Our chief political correspondent Dana Bash and our chief political analyst Gloria Borger is with us as well.

Gloria, why did Rex Tillerson all of a sudden become the nominee for secretary of state? There were several other important people on that list. GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think it was

played out in public pretty much, as we know. I think that at one point somebody like a Mitt Romney might have been a favorite and I think Rex Tillerson's name came into the mix as a result of some folks recommending him, which often happens, and it was -- Bill Gates. I mean --

BLITZER: Bob Gates.

BORGER: Bob Gates, sorry.

BLITZER: The former secretary of defense.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Bill Gates (INAUDIBLE).

BORGER: Former secretary of defense, right. And Condi Rice. A former National Security Adviser Steve Hadley, former National Security adviser. They have a consulting firm. It works with Exxon. And they recommended this guy that Trump did not know to the president-elect. The president-elect said, bring him in, and it turned out that they're two business guys. He believes Tillerson is somebody who can get things done, cut the kinds of deals he wants and took a liking to him. And I think that this was very much a process that played itself out.

[13:25:15] And it was clear to me from watching this on the outside that Trump really didn't have any favorite candidate going into this. And he ended up finding one by taking some people's recommendations.

BLITZER: What did you say, they worked with -- that consulting firm works with Exxon? They get paid by Exxon.

BASH: Worked for it (ph), right?

BORGER: They get -- they work for, I should say.

BLITZER: Yes.

BORGER: They get paid by, yes.

BLITZER: How much of a problem is Tillerson going to have before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee because -- Marco Rubio, he says, "I have serious concerns about Tillerson's nomination, specifically because of his good relationship with Putin."

BASH: Well, there are two steps, right? The first, of course, as you said, is the Foreign Relations Committee. That is the committee that is charged with the confirmation process, will hold the hearing, and then a vote. Without getting out too far ahead of ourselves, it is possible the Senate rules do allow if, for some reason, Marco Rubio is not convinced that Tillerson is the right person, or other Republicans, and even, you know, if some Democrats don't cross party lines, which is possible, and the vote are not there in the Foreign Relations Committee, it is possible for the full Senate to take up the nomination. It happened with John Bolton back in 2005 when he was nominated to be ambassador to the U.N. So that is possible. It's -- we don't know that that will be the way it plays out because

there are actually some moderate Democrats on that committee who might cross party lines and say, you know what, a president should get the nominee that he wants.

And then the broader question, of course, is the full U.S. Senate. And with the 52-48 split, the -- if the Democrats stay lock step against him, the Republicans --

BLITZER: That's a big -- that's a big if.

BASH: A big if, a big if, because, again, there are energy --

BLITZER: And there are a whole bunch of Democrats who run for re- election --

BASH: Producing -- right.

BLITZER: In relatively conservative states in two years.

BASH: And -- right. And Joe Manchin, an energy-producing states and so forth. But -- but the point is, is that if that doesn't happen, he can really only afford to lose two Republicans in the full Senate. So it's -- they certainly have a majority, the Republicans do, but it's tight, especially when you look at people who could be controversial. We don't know that he is ultimately going to be. He could knock the socks off of everybody in the confirmation hearings.

BLITZER: Why do you think he picked him?

RYAN LIZZA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think you have to look at, what is the world view that Tillerson brings that Donald Trump liked, right? And we do know that on foreign policy the big break with the Republican Party that Donald Trump articulated in the campaign was a new view of Russia, right? He voiced skepticism of NATO. He had a campaign manager who was very pro-Russia, worked for a pro-Ukrainian candidate. He praised Vladimir Putin during the campaign. And that alarmed a lot of Republican hawks who think of Vladimir Putin as one of the major adversaries of the United States. So there was a big question, will his secretary of state conform with that world view or will he pick someone different? Mitt Romney would have been very different.

Tillerson, we know, has a long record of doing deals in Russia, has a close relationship with Vladimir Putin. He's actually been awarded a special state award from Vladimir Putin. And so his confirmation now is going to be a proxy fight in the Republican Party over this change in policy that Donald Trump is bringing into the presidency. And that's why you have people like Marco Rubio, Lindsey Graham and John McCain, three leading Republicans on foreign policy, saying, wait a second, I was unsure of Trump when he articulated this policy in the election, and now he's got a secretary of state nominee that's going to push it even further. And I think there's going to be a big, big fight in the Republican Party over this.

BORGER: Here's some potentially other complicating issues, which is, we don't know if he wants to undo the Iran deal.

LIZZA: Yes.

BORGER: I mean, he had been positive towards the Iran deal. Opens up oil markets there. Well, what's he going to say about the Iran deal? We know he was positive about trade agreements. What's he going to say on trade agreement? We know that he was positive about the Paris climate change deal.

LIZZA: Absolutely.

BORGER: So what is he -- what is he going to say about that? These are all issues that have to come up in the confirmation hearings and he my straddle a lot of different lines.

BLITZER: So they --

BASH: And the other thing to that point is that, if you kind of take a step back and now look at the broader cabinet, particularly on national security, that Donald Trump wants to have, there are very big differences.

BLITZER: Yes.

BASH: Mattis, General Mattis --

LIZZA: Yes.

BORGER: Yes.

BASH: Who he wants for defense secretary, has a completely different view of Vladimir Putin.

LIZZA: Absolutely.

BASH: Much more aggressive. Much more inline --

LIZZA: And Iran.

BASH: And Iran.

LIZZA: Yes.

BASH: Much more in line with the McCains and Lindsey Grahams and others within the party.

LIZZA: And you throw the Russian hacking thing in and this confirmation is going to be a -- is going to be a proxy war about the Russian hacking and (INAUDIBLE) policy towards Russia.

BLITZER: We're looking forward -- we're looking forward to covering it every step of the way.

All right, guys, stand by.

[13:30:02] The president-elect, Donald Trump, he welcomed a couple of pro-football Hall of Famers over at Trump Tower in New York City just a few moments ago. It's part of his diversity council meeting.