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New Forecast For Hurricane Michael; Fiancee Of Missing Saudi Journalist Appeals Directly To President Trump For Help In Op-ed. Aired 11-12m ET

Aired October 9, 2018 - 23:00   ET




DON LEMON, CNN TONIGHT NEWS SHOW HOST: This is CNN Tonight. I'm Don Lemon. A big breaking news tonight. A brand-new forecast for monster hurricane Michael. The storm Florida Governor Rick Scott warns could kill you. More than 2.4 million Florida residents in the evacuation zone, millions more under watches and warnings tonight. So, I want to get straight to our meteorologist, let us go to Pedram Javaheri in the CNN Weather Center. Pedram, a new advisory moments ago. Give us the latest.

PEDRAM JAVAHERI, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes, Don. We're seeing a stronger storm now, in fact strengthened by five miles per hour up to 125, which really such just shy, five miles per hour shy would be a category 4. And in fact, the national hurricane had announce says this storm has the potential and it is now forecast to get to a category 4 just before landfall tomorrow around noontime or nearly afternoon hours.

And there we go again, very symmetrical, very organized. It is about a six (inaudible) drop in pressure there in the past couple of hour's that is seen very favorable environment for the storm to continue not only to maintain intensity, but potentially strengthen again. Notice, the outer bands now just about 30 miles offshore.

So, expect some of these tropical force gusts over the next couple of hours to begin to kind of encroach on the coastal communities working its way toward the early afternoon hours. Tomorrow, we have Michael, potentially now at a category 4 as it approaches land.

By the way, only three storms in recorded history since 1950 had made landfall across the Florida Panhandle at a category 3. Never that we had a category 4, in fact this region of Florida. So, certainly this will be a historic storms comes in with a devastating storm surge, as much as 12 feet high across some of these communities east of Panama City. So, we are going to follow this over the next few days.

LEMON: All right. Pedram, thank you very much. We appreciate it. We'll get back to you if needed. It's going to be a very busy couple days for our meteorologist and our correspondents who are out there like Miguel Marquez, he is in Santa Rosa beach. Now, Gary Tuchman is in Apalachicola. Good evening gentlemen to both of you. Listen, I know this area very well, Miguel, this is where I grew up. Santa Rosa beach, my family and I rented a house there, you know, in the summer, sometimes during the winter. You're there. How are people preparing out there?

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, they're preparing by leaving for the most part. There are a few people in this area, but look, it is 10:00 p.m. Local time. The tide came in around 8:00 p.m. But the waves here are still coming up. There should be 40, 50 feet of sea level here. I mean look at -- we were standing out here waiting for this live shot and a giant wave came up, this storm is already starting to push up this way. And it won't be for another four, maybe six hours before they start feeling the first tropical winds.

When you talk to people in this area, they say what's the storm doing? It's now a category 3 we say. And they're shocked when we say it's even strengthening more. We just heard Pedram, the sea is still coming up. This should be moving on low tide now. It's strengthening even more, they're even more shocked. So people who are here are battened down the hatches. And it is now a waiting game. They're just waiting to see just how -- where the storm lands and how bad the damage will be. Don?

LEMON: So you said that people are leaving? I think what, you're along highway 30a where all the businesses and hotels in Santa Rosa beach and Destin and Pensacola and Panama City. Are they ghost towns right now?

MARQUEZ: It is pretty much a ghost town. There is almost not a drop of gasoline to be had in Panama City just east of where we are right now. No stores are open, no restaurants are open. It is pretty much a ghost town everywhere. And in this part as you move farther west from Panama City, there's nobody around. A car maybe once every 30 minutes or so.

[23:05:11] LEMON: All right. Let me get to Gary now. Gary, because you're in Apalachicola, Florida community, that is especially vulnerable to the storm. What are you seeing?

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Don, to be very blunt about it, things here in Apalachicola look very dire. This is one of the towns east of Panama City. So what's going to happen is the hardest part of the winds will be coming here. The eye is going to be just to the west, but the east part is where you get the highest winds. The problem is, this town is a beautiful town. There's Victorian homes and Cape Cod homes and beautiful restaurants. Also seafood workers who catch great oysters here. It is an amazing place. Its population 2,000, but this City and this county of Franklin which has 12,000 mandatory evacuation in the entire county.

And one of the problems with this is City right here, it's kind of a peninsula. The only way off are two long bridges over a bay. So the feeling is with an elevation of 13 feet and potential storm surge of up to 14 feet, that this entire city could be underwater by this time tomorrow. So people have taken heed of the warnings. Most people are gone. Like a said, a mandatory evacuation. And right now, just like Miguel, this is a ghost town. People are very, very worried. Don.

LEMON: Gary and Miguel, thank you both. I appreciate it. Be safe down there. I want to get now to Mark DeMaria in the national hurricane center. Mark, thank you so much for joining us. You've been tracking the storm all night. What can we expect over the next few hours?

MARK DEMARIA, CHIEF TECH AND SCIENCE BRANCH, NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER: Well, it looks like the system is now approaching its landfall. It's about 12 hours or so from reaching the coast. However, we expect to see the impacts coming in pretty soon. You can see in the outer bands on the radar image that they should be approaching the Apalachicola area within the next six hours or so. And we've already seen buoy measurements of winds of tropical storm force there. And those moving along the coast in the early morning hours tonight and the conditions to continue to deteriorate as the center gets closer to land.

LEMON: So, Mark, we know all hurricanes are different, right. And the wind is a bigger danger than others. The water, sometimes they're equal. Which one about this one specifically? Wind, water or both?

DEMARIA: This hurricane is wind and water in this case. With the borderline category 3-4 intensity, significant wind damage along the coast will expend inland as we've seen with other hurricanes where you have a lot of forested areas. It doesn't take hurricane winds to cause significant damage. And then the storm surge, as well is a major threat with the gulf coast very vulnerable to storm surge and with the values 9 to 13 feet, this is essentially life-threatening surge in that area. The surge, wind, as well.

LEMON: So Mark, I want to put up some video now, this is of hurricane Dennis, 2005. Last time that a major hurricane hit the Florida Panhandle. The best and worst case scenario for those who are bracing for this hurricane this time?

DEMARIA: In this case, this is a very threatening storm. It's hard to compare storms with each other. The Dennis in this case was a little bit further west. This is a more serious threat for the Florida Panhandle area with the landfall expected between Pensacola and Apalachicola as well as slightly stronger intensity predicted.

LEMON: OK. Thank you, Mark DeMaria, from National Hurricane Center, I appreciate your time.

I want to get to the mayor of Apalachicola. Mark just mentioned it. It is Mayor Van Johnson. Mayor, thank you so much, appreciate your time. Thank you for joining us. Listen, I understand that the governor told you would to evacuate your city, as well. Can you walk us through the preparations happening there tonight?

MAYOR VAN JOHNSON, APALACHICOLA, FLORIDA: Yes, I can. We issued a state of emergency yesterday. And as well as the state of Florida and Franklin county. And we issued also a mandatory evacuation asking all businesses and residents to take the storm serious and leave. The community has been boarded up. They have been making preparation. So when they come back, it's an easy transition back into the community, but basically, we just telling people to get out.

LEMON: How is it going so far?

JOHNSON: So far, the winds are picking up slightly. We are anticipating the storm intensifying tomorrow, but right now it's pretty much calm before the storm.

LEMON: And the evacuations, are they going well? Are people heeding the warning?

JOHNSON: Unfortunately, not in my conversations with the chief today, we have a handful of people who have chosen to stay and I'm really dismayed at that because again, this is a life-threatening storm. If anything I can get across, it's to leave, leave now.

LEMON: Mayor, this will be the first major hurricane to hit the Panhandle since 2005.

[23:10:00] I showed some video of it just moments ago to Mark DeMaria from National Hurricane Center. Just the fourth since 1950 this will be. What is your biggest fear right now?

JOHNSON: My biggest fear is flooding, erosion, structure damage. And for those people that didn't heed the warning, possible loss of life.

LEMON: Yes. Wow. You know, mayor, a major category three that is a major storm. Sustained winds up to 120 miles per hour. What kind of damage could that do to your town? You know the specifics, you know how things are built there. What kind of damage could it do?

JOHNSON: It would be catastrophic. We are talking about homes that was built in the 1800s. It's a historic community. I could see the inventory of historical homes being if not permanently damaged then could be lost forever.

LEMON: Governor, listen, the mayor, I'm sorry, the governor got that confused calls this a monstrous storm. It could be the most destructive to hit the Panhandle in decades. 24 hours, next 24 hours, what do you think that is going to be like for all of you?

JOHNSON: It's going to be frantic. You know it's serious when I get a call from the White House concerned with the state of Apalachicola.

LEMON: Thank you, Mayor Van Johnson of Apalachicola.

JOHNSON: You're welcome.

LEMON: Best of luck to you down there. Thank you so much for joining us. So make sure you stay with CNN for the very latest on this monstrous hurricane Michael. And we are going to have more breaking news tonight for you as well.

"The Washington Post" reporting new shocking details about the disappearance of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, saying the U.S. Intelligence reportedly intercepted communications of Saudi officials discussing a plan to capture him. More on than next. [23:15:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: So shocking new details tonight about the disappearance of journalist Jamal Khashoggi who has been missing for a week now. "The Washington Post" is reporting that a squad of 15 men from Saudi Arabia were lying in wait for Khashoggi when he entered the Saudi consulate in Istanbul on October 2nd. The "Post" also reporting that the U.S. Intelligence intercepted communications of Saudi officials discussing a plan to capture him. That is according to a source. I want to bringing in now Karen Attiah, the Global Opinions editor for "The Post," she joins us on the phone.

Karen, we appreciate you joining us here. I just want to give some of your reporting from the paper before you respond. So before Khashoggi disappearance, U.S. Intelligence intercepted communications of Saudi officials discussing a plan to capture him according to a person familiar with the information. The Saudi's wanted to lure Khashoggi back to Saudi Arabia and lay hands on him there, this person said. It was not clear whether the Saudi's intended to arrest and interrogate Khashoggi or to kill him or if the United States warned Khashoggi that he was a target this person said. So I know that you must have many, many questions about this reporting which I should say CNN has not independently confirmed. But what's going on here?

KAREN ATTIAH, GLOBAL OPINIONS EDITOR, THE POST: Yes. I mean, as Jamal's editor for the past year reading that tidbit just made my heart sink. I think you know, as far as my conversations went with him over the last year or so, as I've been saying, I would ask him, are you OK? Do you have any specific threats? He would normally just talk about the threats that his children were facing from Saudi, but never, I mean, never relayed them necessarily to me. That being said, I knew he was under a lot of pressure. This you know, this reporting just, well, we know that at the very least the state department and its human rights report for Saudi Arabia specifically named Jamal or referenced Jamal in its report, but this idea that he was known to be targeted only raises first of all raises doubts, right? On the Saudis' accounts of, you know, caring for the welfare of Jamal. It only raises a burden of proof even higher for them to produce proof of their account that he actually left the consulate safe and sound.

LEMON: So Karen, you know, the post is reporting that there was an alleged 50-man team in Istanbul waiting for Khashoggi's arrival to the consulate and they came into Turkey from Saudi Arabia on private jets. Stayed in hotels in Istanbul. It's so brazen that in many ways it's hard to believe.

ATTIAH: I'm still processing it. It is hard to believe. At the same time, again, the Saudis are denying it. Bu at the same time, you know, look, this is a regime that allegedly according to accounts potentially kidnapped the Lebanese Prime Minister Harere. This is a regime that Jamal himself wrote in his pieces saying the level of intolerance and cruelty has not been seen before. So from all my communications with people who are familiar with like the regime, they say you know, you can't put it past them to have done this. At the same time, you know, obviously, this calls into question just what type of U.S. ally would possibly do such a thing. You know, if the reports are true to send a hit squad to kill someone who is trying to get married at a consulate, it's just historic levels of cruelty and monstrosity in my opinion.

[23:20:03] LEMON: Listen, I just want to make it clear. You said you've been his editor for a year, right?

ATTIAH: Correct.

LEMON: How reliable do you believe the information coming from the Turkish government is? Is there any reason to doubt their accounts here?

ATTIAH: I mean, you know, as far as I know, Jamal had friends within the Turkish government. He was in close contact with Erdogan. You know, it is distressing to say the least to hear sort of worst case scenarios accounts on Saturday and then to hear you know, rumors or leaks that may be he is alive, but the back and forth is hard to take. I think either way, somebody knows out there what happened to Jamal. Someone knows exactly happened. It's on both the Turks and the Saudis to just come forward and prove, show evidence of their claims. We still haven't seen that yet, but I fear over the next few days we may be hearing more, but as time goes on, it just -- our hopes, it's hard to keep hopes up.

LEMON: So, Karen, you know, the Saudi ambassador to Washington who is a younger brother of the Saudi crown prince said it goes without saying that his family and the kingdom remain gravely concerned about him and so are we. Do you believe the Saudi royal family when they say that they share your concern?

ATTIAH: How can I? How can I? After being in touch with Jamal saying that he knew he couldn't go home expressed to me that he was sad not being able to go home to celebrate women driving, something that he had pushed for as an editor back in Saudi Arabia. He was seeing his friends being taken to jail. He talked to me about torture. That does not sound at all like a regime that cares about the welfare of people who dare even mildly criticize them. So sitting here right now potentially mourning my friend and a close colleague, a bright courageous colleague who didn't want to be a dissident, who just wanted to be a journalist, it's hard for me to take that as true.

LEMON: Well, Karen, we thank you for calling in and our thoughts are with you. And we can only imagine the pain that you guys are dealing with. OK? Keep us updated. OK?

ATTIAH: All right. And thank you so much for shedding light on this.

LEMON: Thank you. I want to bring in now, Max Boot to talk about this because Max, I just want to get your thoughts. The information coming from "The Washington Post" U.S. Intelligence may have had a reason to believe that Khashoggi was a target of a plot to capture him.

MAX BOOT, COUNCIL FOR FOREIGN RELATIONS: That is shocking if that information was not shared with him. Obviously, the intelligence community wants to protect it sources. That is the kind of information that should be shared with somebody who is a U.S. Resident. I mean, this whole thing is just so unconscionable, Don. I am so outrage. Jamal Khashoggi is a hero of the free press. He is somebody who risked his life to tell the truth about Saudi Arabia, to criticize the government of Saudi Arabia. He was standing up for the freedom of people in Saudi Arabia and really freedom all around the world. And unfortunately, we don't have a government in the United States right now that stands for those principles.

We have a President who refers to the media as the enemy of the people. Jamal Khashoggi was not the enemy of the people. But that is how he was treated apparently by the government of Saudi Arabia if the latest reporting is accurate. You know, this is not something we're used to seeing. I mean, if these reports are the accurate, they lured him into their consulate in Istanbul on the soil of a NATO country and killed and dismembered him. This is the way the most brutal heinous regimes in the world behave. This is not the kind of behavior we expect from an American ally. If this in fact was done by an American ally, there have to be consequences, Don. This administration cannot sweep this under the rug.

LEMON: Let me ask you Jared Kushner has a relationship with the Crown Prince.

BOOT: Yes.

LEMON: He can call the crown prince, tonight or tomorrow. Should he? I mean --

BOOT: He better be.

LEMON: We don't know what is going on behind the scene.

BOOT: Jared Kushner is not reading B.S., the crown prince the riot act. He is being derelict in his duty. If the Donald Trump is not getting in touch with the king of Saudi Arabia, he is being derelict in his duty. They cannot ignore this. And their statement so far have been completely inadequate. They need to make clear that our relationship with Saudi Arabia is going to be permanently damaged if these allegations are true and the Saudis need to come clean about exactly what happened.

[23:25:00] LEMON: The Khashoggi's fiancee is making a personal appeal to the President and the first lady tonight. The story is so compelling. Frankly the implications are so frightening if it's true. You should expect them both to be moved by this. Correct?

BOOT: They should be, but the problem is that President Trump has shown no regard for human rights. He has basically given a blank check to the government of Saudi Arabia. He loved being received in Riyadh. That was his first trip abroad. He was treated like a visiting potentate. He love that, he ate it up. He never brings up human rights with the King of Saudi Arabia or any of these other regimes that he meets with.

He just loves being glad handed and feted in places like Riyadh. My concern is that because he doesn't bring these things up, governments in places like we had, see that as a blank check to their worse and to imagine the United States is not going to do anything about it. And it is imperative the United States do something about it, because, let us remember, Jamal Khashoggi was not an American citizen, but he was an American resident. He did wrote for an American newspaper, the same one I wrote for, "The Washington Post." the U.S. Government has to do something about this.

LEMON: Max, thank you for your thoughts.

BOOT: Thank you.

LEMON: We'll be right back.


DON LEMON, CNN TONIGHT HOST: President Trump used his rally in Iowa tonight to slam Democrats with what seems to be the latest GOP talking point. Here to discuss, Alice Stewart, Maria Cardona, Matt Lewis and back with me, Max Boot. His new book is the "Corrosion of Conservatism: Why I left the Right."

So, thank you all for joining us. Welcome back, Max. So listen, Maria, the president speaking at a rally tonight touched on what is the latest way to undermine anyone who opposes him. Watch this.


DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: You don't hand matches to an arsonist, and you don't give power to an angry left-wing mob. That's what the Democrats have become.


TRUMP: They would turn our country so fast into Venezuela and Venezuela is not doing too well, folks.


LEMON: So, we are hearing that time and time again. Who he is talking about?

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I guess what he was talking about is the women who are very angry and expressed their anger, I think, quite adamantly during the Kavanaugh hearings because they were women who had gone through the trauma and the tragedy of being sexually assaulted at some point or maybe several times during their lifetime.

And they were trying to tell their stories to Republican men, who did nothing but either one away from them or completely make fun of them, treat them disrespectfully, and in a manner that just dripped of disdain and denigration.

And so for me, the more that he talks about an angry mob and the more that women understand that he's talking about them and complaining about them when they were trying to tell their stories, the better it is not just for Democrats but for independents and those frankly moderate Republicans suburban women --

LEMON: Yeah.

CARDONA: -- who don't like what this country has become under Trump and Republicans who have wrapped themselves around him.

LEMON: Alice, before you answer, I want you to keep that passion. Your party won, right? They have the White House, they got the Congress, they have two hand-picked justices in the last year. People who don't agree with it are exercising one of their options which is protest. He's calling them a mob. Is that a bit much?

ALICE STEWART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, not when you see what they've been doing. Look, I don't think you need to tell me that we won, you need to tell those people out there that are banging on the doors of the Supreme Court and chasing senators out of public restaurants and yelling at senators in elevators -- look, the Republicans won.

They knew that that meant that the president would have the opportunity to appoint one, possibly two nominees to be confirmed on the Supreme Court. They should actually acknowledge that. If they spent more time handing out voter registration forms across the country, they would be much more effective --

CARDONA: Oh, that's happening.

LEMON: Alice, that doesn't mean that people don't -- I mean, Alice, that doesn't mean that people don't get to object. I mean, that's your right --


LEMON: -- as an American, to object. It's covered in the First Amendment, like the first one.


STEWART: Sure, they certainly --

CARDONA: Petition your government.

STEWART: Sure, they certainly can do that, but what he's saying and we're seeing it across the country, going to a restaurant and screaming at an elected official in a public restaurant, they did the same to Sarah Sanders, they have done the same to Kirstjen Nielsen, they have done it to many members of this administration because they object with the policies of this president and what the elected officials were elected to do, that's not how you go about doing it.

CARDONA: But that's not what he's talking about.

STEWART: That's exactly what he's talking about.


CARDONA: He's talking about the protests.

MATT LEWIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Imagine what would happen --

LEMON: Go ahead, Matt.

LEWIS: Imagine what would happen -- let's just put -- turn this around. Hillary Clinton wins and she names a Supreme Court nominees. Republicans are upset. Imagine if there was a Democratic senator and his wife at a restaurant and the alt-right, your Richard Spencer's crew comes rolling in, yelling at them, berating them, trying to shame them --

LEMON: That's -- OK. Matt, Matt, Matt, you had me. You had me until you said -- hold on, Matt.

LEWIS: Imagine that. Would you -- who's your protector?

LEMON: You had me until you said alt-right. Until you said alt-right, you had me.

LEWIS: OK, what about, say, Tea Party? Forget the alt-right. Let's say Tea Party protesters.

LEMON: OK, that is a better example than the other one you gave.

LEWIS: Would we be wringing our hands and clutching our pearls and saying, we can't call that, you know, a mob. Those are protests? No, that is mob behavior.

CARDONA: How many times has that happened, Matt?

LEMON: Everybody stop, everybody stop. Matt, we already did that. We already said they weren't mobs.

[23:35:01] We already said that --

LEWIS: They are mobs.

LEMON: No, no, no. We already said that the Tea Party people -- we went through this, because you don't remember.

LEWIS: Because the Tea Party people didn't hound people at a restaurant.

LEMON: The Tea Party didn't hound people? Tea Party people hounded me when I went out to cover them. And you know what I said? It was their right to do it because they're Americans.

LEWIS: Don, if they starred following you around a restaurant and running you out of places and cornering you --

LEMON: I don't say they're wrong because I'm not an elected official.

LEWIS: It would be a mob.

LEMON: I'm not an elected official. If I put my name on a ballot and I won office --

LEWIS: They're not going to come after journalists, Don.

LEMON: Journalists are not public officials and not public servants.

CARDONA: Here's the problem. Trump isn't just talking about those people.

LEMON: Let Max get in.

MAX BOOT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: I think there is a small element of truth on both sides here which is that there is incivility on both sides of the political spectrum. And I deplore activists who are hounding public officials in restaurants. I think that's wrong. It backfires. It feeds into the victimization narrative that Trump tries to put out there. It's counterproductive.

But on the other hand, Donald Trump is in no position to complain about mob rule when he is speaking tonight in front of an actual mob and they are chanting "lock her up" about Senator Dianne Feinstein. He is in no position to talk about mob rule when he incites his followers at these rallies such that members of the media who are there often feel threatened.

In fact, during the campaign in 2016, there was actual violence at the Trump rallies, OK? That is mob rule. As much as anything else, I think we all need to calm down, took a step back --

LEWIS: I agree, Max.

CARDONA: And when you don't --


LEMON: Let him finish, Max, and then you can get in.

BOOT: -- complaining about which is --

LEWIS: I'm trying to agree with that.

BOOT: Let me finish. On both sides, we need greater civility. And Donald Trump is not showing that kind of civility when he accuses Democrats, for example, of being traitors who are going to turn this country into Venezuela. That is not reasonable civilized discourse. And so yes, you can complain about the tactics of some progressive activists, but you got to be fair and talk about the tactics of the right and Donald Trump as well and they are deplorable.


LEMON: Let Matt get in. Matt, go ahead.

CARDONA: Nobody is condoning -- nobody is condoning when people chase senators into restaurants.

LEWIS: I was going to say, the difference between --

LEMON: One at a time. Maria, I'll let you get in. Let Matt finish. Go ahead.

LEWIS: -- center right journalists and liberal activists is, I will admit that it is for Donald -- that it is a mob behavior. It is a mob mentality when Donald Trump and the people say, lock her up. I'm going to admit that. I'm waiting for liberals and, you know, intellectually honest liberals to admit that when you harassed Ted Cruz at a restaurant, that is also mob-like behavior.

Why is it that I'm willing to concede that Donald Trump is a bad person and that that's mob behavior, but I never hear liberals come on or center left --

CARDONA: I am about to say -- I am about to say that that kind of behavior following senators or any other elected official into a restaurant when they're with their family, I don't agree with that. I do not condone that.

LEWIS: Is it mob behavior? Is it mob-like behavior?

CARDONA: I don't know. How many were there? I don't even know --

LEWIS: Let's put the video, Don. You got some roll (ph)? Let's show the video.

LEMON: No, OK, listen, I got to get to the break. I got to get to the break. I'm going to answer -- hey, both of, please stop. OK, I've got to get to the break. I will answer your question. Is it mob behavior? No, it's not mob behavior.

It's people who are upset and angry with the way the country is going and the policies that these people -- will you let me finish, Matt, please, before you jump in? OK? I'm making a point. I can't make it if you keep interrupting me.

LEWIS: You're making a point. Are you the moderator or the host or are you arguing a liberal --

LEMON: I'm the moderator and the host of this show --

CARDONA: Oh, my, now who is acting like a mob?

LEMON: -- and I'm trying to make a point to tell you that -- you're giving mob rule.


LEMON: I'm telling you why people are --

LEWIS: Look up the word "mob" in the dictionary.

LEMON: Matt, you should look up the word "mob" in the dictionary. You should also as a Republican look at the constitution --

LEWIS: I'm not a Republican.

LEMON: -- and look at -- whatever it is you are. Whatever it is you are. Look at the constitution of the United States. And it gives people the right to protest.

LEWIS: Yeah, I agree.

LEMON: It doesn't say where you can protest and how you can protest.

LEWIS: Nobody is saying it's illegal.

LEMON: Will you let me finish? Matt, please! Let me finish.

LEWIS: Fine. Bring it on. Mind if I have a drink?

LEMON: So, you can do whatever you want. You can leave the show if you want. But let me finish. I will make my point.

LEWIS: I'm not going to do that.

LEMON: OK, well then shut up and let me do it, all right? Thank you very much. In the constitution, you can protest whenever and wherever you want. It doesn't tell you that you can't do it in a restaurant. It doesn't tell you that you can't do it on a football field. It doesn't tell you that you can't do it on a cable news show.

You can do it wherever you want. And to call people mobs because they are exercising their constitutional right is just beyond the pail. We'll be right back.


LEMON: Hillary Clinton sitting down for a wide-ranging interview with CNN's Christiane Amanpour, talking about the lack of civility in Washington, the Kavanaugh hearings and the midterms, and explaining why after losing the election she wanted to give President Trump a chance. But now, saying she is worried. Listen to this.


HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: I started worrying at his inauguration both because of what he said in his speech which I thought was defiant, defensive, dystopian, it wasn't a speech to bring together people who had not supported him, but instead it was aimed as I say in my book "What Happened" that the, you know, the white nationalist gut.

And then over the course of now two years nearly since the election, we have seen him degrading the rule of law, we have seen him delegitimizing our elections.

[23:45:00] We have seen him spreading corruption, both him personally, his family business, others in his administration. We have seen him also attacking truth and facts even reason itself, and fundamentally trying to undermine our national unity.

So, I was hopeful. I wanted to give him a chance. I think every new president deserves a chance. But every month that's gone by, I've become more and more worried about how he governs and how he treats people.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: You have said women's rights are human rights and human rights are women's rights. What do you think the Kavanaugh hearings, what kind of impact will they have on the midterms? Because at first, the Democrats were quite happy that it might galvanize. Now, the Republicans are happy that it will galvanize their base. What do you think is going to happen?

CLINTON: I think that both sides will be galvanized. It's just a question of who actually takes those feelings and shows up to vote. And it always comes down to that. We have more voters who favor Democratic candidates.

One of the tragedies of what's happened in our electoral system is the Republicans have systematically suppressed voters probably as many, Christiane, as 12 million voters were purged by Republican governments in states between 2012 and 2016.

We have all kinds of questions about the security of our voting machines. So, we know that Democrats have to turn out in even bigger numbers in a lot of congressional districts and states.

AMANPOUR: Last night, President Trump had a sort of ceremony for now Justice Kavanaugh at the White House. He apologized on behalf of the American people for the immense amount of pain and harm that he said that the judge had been put through by this system. What do you make of that? And what message, including the president's mocking of Christine Blasey Ford for her allegations, what message does that send to women?

CLINTON: What was done last night in the White House was a political rally. It further undermined the image and integrity of the court. And that troubles me greatly. It saddens me because our judicial system has been viewed as one of the main pillars of our constitutional government.

So, I don't know how people are going to react to it. I think given our divides, it will pretty much fall predictably between those who are for and those who are against. But the president has been true to form. He has insulted, attacked, demeaned women throughout the campaign really for many years leading up to the campaign, and he's continued to do that inside the White House.

AMANPOUR: Do you see any way -- even a conservative who I was speaking to yesterday said the only way to repair America is to try to get back to some civility and to try to make it that even if we have political disagreements, we're not going to war with each other, we're not trying to destroy each other.

CLINTON: Certainly, I would love to see us return to civility, listening to one another, working out our differences. That is not the Republican Party that exists today and that is certainly not the administration that we have in power right now. When the Republican Senate denied the right of President Obama to have his nominee for the Supreme Court, Merrick Garland, heard.

AMANPOUR: I think you even wrote that they stole a justice from the Democratic Party.

CLINTON: Well, I think they did. I mean, to keep a Supreme Court seat open for a year, to deny a distinguished jurist, they could have voted him down. They could have said, well, for ideological reasons, philosophical reasons, we're not going to vote for him. But no, they stonewalled.

That was such a breach of Senate ethics and the constitutional responsibility of the Senate to advise and consent on nominations that you cannot be civil with a political party that wants to destroy what you stand for, what you care about. That's why I believe if we are fortunate enough to win back the House and or the Senate, that's when civility can start again.


LEMON: A lot to dig into, and we will. Alice, Maria, Matt, and Max are back with me, next.


LEMON: Back with me, Alice, Maria, Matt, and Max. What do you think of Hillary Clinton's comments, Max?

BOOT: Well, I agreed with a lot of what she said of criticizing the Republicans, but there was one part of what she said that just made my jaw drop because this is so wacky. She said, I believe if we are fortunate enough to win back the House and Senate, that's when civility can start again, but until then, the only thing that the Republicans respect is strength.

Well, that's crazy. What she's saying is that as long as Democrats are in the minority, they don't have to be civil, it's only once they're in the majority that everybody has to be civil. That's basically giving a license to the Republican because that's -- you know, you can't have one-sided civility only if you're out of power.

LEMON: We're short on time. Maria, do you want to respond? Quickly, please.

CARDONA: I think she was one thousand percent correct in everything she said and she reminded the millions of women out there who are angry and the sensible men who are angry as well about the direction, the disgusting divisions that this president has taken this country, and the sycophantic Congress that has followed him completely blindly, that we can change that in November.

[23:55:01] But it is up to us. And yes, we have to do it in a way that is aggressive but it is in our hands.

LEMON: Alice, go ahead, quickly.

STEWART: With regard to the judges, she knows darn good and well, if she would have won and if Democrats controlled the Senate, she would be celebrating the two left-leaning justices on the Supreme Court. She would be also nudging Ruth Bader Ginsburg into early retirement, so she could do another. That's where she is on that.

LEMON: Matt, I'm really short. Go on.

LEWIS: Look, just a week ago, people on the left were accusing the Republican nominee to the Supreme Court of being at a gang rape and now Hillary Clinton saying, we've got to fight tougher, like, Democrats have to take off the gloves now and we can't be civil? This is the problem. It's a race to the bottom. Somebody has to stand up. I wish the Democrats had said, we're going to be the civil party, we're going to be the party that's not like Trump.

LEMON: OK. Listen, I just --

CARDONA: We will.

LEMON: I just want to read this. This is from September of 2009. The reason that it's so horrifying to me and many people, the comparison being made between protesters, the Tea Party, and even neo-Nazis on this show earlier.

Washington, CNN. The conservative advocacy group Tea Party expressed mass at a U.S. capital on Saturday to protest health care reform, higher taxes, and what they see as out-of-control government spending.

Marchers en route to the rally held no feelings in check as they waved signs reading, proud member of the angry mob, I didn't vote for this abomination, fire the Czars, and you represent us, not rule us.

Nazi imagery and a poster of President Obama as an African witch doctor were popular images.

Thanks for watching, everyone. Our coverage continues.