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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Trump: I Regret Not Always Choosing Right Words; Trump Buys $4 Million In TV Ad Time; Clinton Foundation Will Limit Donations if Clinton Elected; Bill Clinton Won't Give Paid Speeches If Hillary Is Elected; Two American Swimmers Headed Home; Brazilian Police: U.S. Swimmers Vandals, Not Victims; Video Of Bloodied Boy Captures Syria War Horrors. Aired 9-10p ET.
Aired August 18, 2016 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: It was in fact a different sort of Donald Trump than we've heard and seen so far.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Sometimes in the heat of debate and speaking on a multitude of issues, you don't choose the right words or you say the wrong thing. I have done that. And believe it or not, I regret it. And I do regret it, particularly where it may have caused personal pain.
Too much is at stake for us to be consumed with these issues, but one thing I can promise you this. I will always tell you the truth. Aren't you tired of the same old lies and the same old broken promises? And Hillary Clinton has proven to be one of the greatest liars of all time.
We're going to reject bigotry and I will tell you, the bigotry of Hillary Clinton is amazing. She sees communities of color only as votes and not as human beings worthy of a better future. It's only votes. If African-American voters give Donald Trump a chance by giving me their vote, the result for them will be amazing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Donald Trump tonight in Charlotte. CNN's Jason Carroll is there for us. The first day, Jason, after Trump's campaign overhaul and a different certain kind of speech from Donald Trump?
JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Much different. Much different from what we've heard, you know, heard in the past and talking to the many of those who were in the room tonight. It was really well received by those here in the room.
One woman telling me, she said, look, this wasn't just Donald Trump, in her words, running his mouth. She said this time he had substance and he sounded more presidential. Another man I spoke to said that it really seemed as if he was speaking from the heart.
That direct appeal to the African-American community, you know this Anderson. We heard this before. Earlier this week in West Bend, Wisconsin where he made that same appeal, making it here again tonight in Charlotte. Again, really well received.
One woman, Caroline Rogers, she's 63 years old. She is African- American. She's never voted Republican before. She was right here in the audience and she told me this is a man who finally spoke to what I've been thinking for quite a long time. Anderson?
COOPER: At one point, I mean, apology maybe it's a strong word. He expressed regret, as sort of a generalized regret. He said there are things he's regretted. That is something we simply have not heard from him before. In fact, he's continually denied that he has anything to regret.
CARROLL: Right, right. And this is as close as an apology you probably going to get from a Donald Trump. And again, extremely well received here in this crowd. I can't tell you how many rallies I've been to when I've heard from supporters who said repeatedly we like this man. We stand behind him, but we wish he would stop putting his foot in his mouth.
And when I spoke to someone here about that tonight, this man told me he said, this is exactly what he needs to do going forward. He's sounding presidential when he's now finally admitting that he's said some things in the past that he should not have said. It's time to move beyond that and stick to the issues.
What we're really seeing here, though, here, Anderson, is an attempt by the Trump campaign to expand the base. That's what they need to do, they know, if they're going to pull out a win in November.
COOPER: And we've learned now Donald Trump and Mike Pence are expected to travel to Baton Rouge tomorrow?
CARROLL: That is correct. And you remember even at the top of the speech that he gave here, Donald Trump talked about the heartbreak and the devastation of what's going on there in Baton Rouge. And he said one thing that was in quote, he said "We are one nation. When one state hurts, we all hurt. We must all work together."
Again, using that word all, one nation, trying to be inclusive, trying to bring in communities of color, trying to bring in those independents, trying to bring in those people still on the fence about Donald Trump and a lot of people here tonight feel as though he was successful in making that theme apparent in his speech tonight.
COOPER: All right, Jason Carroll. Jason, thanks very much. Back with the panel.
John King, it was interesting, we didn't hear Donald Trump use the term "crooked Hillary."
[21:05:03] When the crowd started chanting lock her up, you know, he sort of smiled, but then put up his hand sort of you wanting to move along. I guess part of his plan at least tonight. JOHN KING, CNN ANCHOR, INSIDE POLITICS: Well, I'd be a little careful on that point. He didn't call her "crooked Hillary" at least not from what I heard, but he did say one of the world's great all time liars.
KING: He did go out and make the case
COOPER: I just meant the catch phrases.
KING: ... that she lies repeatedly. The catch phrase has goes away a little bit. So, we'll see if that continues. Again, I just want to say, what I said about last hour, this is one speech and one of the conversations we've had repeated in this campaign as we have gone through Trump 2.0, Trump 3.0, Trump 4.0 and so on is whether he continues to focus discipline. But this was a very well-crafted speech.
A lot of focus on that vague, Bakari Sellers had regret line, but which will get a lot of attention because Donald Trump never says he regrets anything. But the rest of the speech was very well-crafted, the insider versus outsider, the change versus the status quo, trying to make it a referendum on Clinton and on Obama. But just one other quick point, though, Anderson.
Number one, the Hillary Clinton campaign is dismissing this. They're saying this is Donald Trump's speech writer and his teleprompter. They realized he had a lot to apologize for, but he wasn't very specific, what is it specifically he's apologizing for, trying to press him to keep it up. And number two, if you go back in that phrase, there's a bit of strategic gambit by the Trump campaign in it. After saying he regrets some things, he said too much is a stake to be consumed by these issues. You can bet the next time you try to ask him or someone in the campaign about it, they will say, "Hey, he said he regrets this. Move on."
COOPER: Phil, it's interesting point. And -- I mean, how effective -- I mean, I guess we'll see what happens in the coming days because we have seen Donald Trump in previous weeks give a speech and then, again, go off prompter and get himself into days of trying to explain what he meant.
PHILIP BUMP, WASHINGTON POST POLITICAL REPORTER: Right. And then days of defending that he stood by what he said in the first place. You know, I think this is one of the three legs of the stool that have been a problem for Donald Trump is his speeches that bet you are the interviews with reporters and Twitter. If he can sit an interview with a reporter and not say something like that's how the whole Gold Star family thing blew out of control was his response to a reporter's question.
If he cannot retweet something or if he cannot, you know, if he can keep all that in check, then yes. This is a different sort of campaign that we've seen from Donald Trump. So far he's not been proven to be able to do that. CHRISTINE QUINN, CLINTON SUPPORTER: You know, I think the real question for Donald Trump as he -- we think starts to try to reach out to other communities is, what is he actually have that would be helpful to communities? You know, he talked incorrectly tonight about facts relating to the African-American community in America. So that wasn't truthful.
But, if you look at his plan, particularly his economic plans. There's a reform of the estate tax which would not help 99.8 percent of Americans. It won't help them. But if Donald Trump is as rich as he says and we don't know, it could end up with $4 billion more in the Trumps' pockets.
His tax credit gives $60 cents of the dollar to people who have nannies, but nothing to struggling working Americans. Many of whom are African-American who don't have childcare. He has tax cuts, trillions of dollars for millionaires and billionaires, but not focused once on other folks.
COOPER: Kayleigh, I see you're shaking your head.
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, TRUMP SUPPORTER: Yeah. I mean, first of all, that's not true. The stats he used tonight, the 58 percent ...
BAKARI SELLERS, CLINTON SUPPORTER: That's not true.
MCENANY: ... number of African-Americans being unemployed that's true for African-Americans 18 to 21. That is the real conclusion. And then I'll send you out the included facts (inaudible).
SELLERS: That's not -- that's not -- no, but stop. No, no, no. Because PolitiFact has already done -- and PolitiFact actually -- they actually rated, this as mostly false because what it takes into account are people who are in high school, people who are in college, people who are not even looking for work.
SELLERS: And if you want to say that statistics, I will not -- we're not sitting on our behinds just being unemployed. The statistic is not 58 percent. And if you're going to throw that out there then you have to also throw out the fact that 49 percent of white Americans who fit in the same category are also unemployed.
MCENANY: That's certainly true. All of that's true.
SELLERS: So, you have to say both in order for ...
COOPER: But it is misleading -- that -- don't you think it's misleading to say more than 50 percent of African-Americans?
MCENANY: You know, it's not misleading is the fact that Democrats have promised the African-American community jobs and higher wages and ... s COOPER: But again -- but I mean, I've never heard of an unemployment rate that includes people in high school and in college.
MCENANY: OK. It's a real number. That is a real number. If he got it from the ...
MCENANY: No, no. He got it from the Bureau of Labor of Statistics. That is a real number.
COOPER: The actually unemployment rate I think from over the last -- whether it was 9 percent among African-American ...
SELLERS: No, no, no. I don't. In fact, I don't want to focus on that.
MCENANY: I know Bakari wants to focus on one statistic. But let me give ...
SELLERS: No, no. I want to focus on his speech in this (inaudible) about the speech with African-American.
MCENANY: Let me give you the other -- OK, well, great. Let me give you the other statistics he used. The fact that four in 10 African- American children are in poverty, the fact that there are more African-Americans than white children in failing schools and a lot of that is due to Democrats protecting the teachers union at the...
SELLERS: That's so disrespectful.
MCENANY: Yes. Yes, it is.
SELLERS: No, it's disrespectful.
MCENANY: No. Do you know what's disrespectful?
COOPER: Let her finish then you response.
MCENANY: What is disrespectful is Democrats have promised this community a lot of things for a long time and they've not materialized. I guarantee you, if you go into the inner cities and ask the people who live there are, are you better off today than you were eight years ago? The answer is absolutely not which is why Donald Trump talks about ...
SELLERS: Well, I mean I'm just going to -- let me throw this out, they're just to be pretty blunt.
[21:10:00] I'm African-American, in case we didn't know that. And so I live in these communities. I'm part of this community. And what Donald Trump said today, his plea was that, you know what, what else do you have to lose? It was very naive.
SELLERS: It was very naive. It was very insulting because the fact of the matter is, Donald Trump has no comprehension of intersectionality.
QUINN: That's right.
SELLERS: The fact is, you don't have the comprehension of intersectionality. People have a hard time understanding that fundamental systems in this country, the criminal justice system, the economic system, the economic injustices, the environmental injustices that we have in Flint. Flint doesn't happen in white America. Flint happens in black America.
You have a quarter of shame. You have people in this country who literally, you can point out where they are predisposed to have more amputations than others who are majority African-American.
SELLERS: The systems are broken. You have ...
SELLERS: ... a group of people who 40, 50, 60 years ago were being broken by Jim Crow.
MCENANY: Exactly. You're making my point.
SELLER: No, no. I'm actually not making your point.
MCENANY: You said you're in this community ...
SELLERS: I'm actually -- let me just finish.
SELLERS: Let me actually finish. Because of the simple fact that Donald Trump can't comprehend that, you cannot say that someone who got sued twice by the Department of Justice for failure to rent to African-Americans. You can't say that someone who took out a pro- death penalty piece for the Central Park Five. You can't simply say that somebody who started the Birther Movement all of a sudden cares about intersectionality and African-Americans. And my last point, Anderson, because I know you want to move on.
MCENANY: No, no, I want ...
SELLERS: But -- no, no. My last point is that, today something monumental happened today with criminal justice reform. The United States Department of Justice said we will no longer contract with private prisons. Donald Trump, if we're talking about him weaving things in, weaving headlines in, if Donald Trump wants to talk to African-Americans, it would be good to do it in a room full of African-Americans or actually listen, but he couldn't begin to talk about the issues that are near and dear to our hearts.
MCENANY: Bakari, the first half of what you said just made my entire point.
SELLERS: It did not.
MCENANY: No, no, please, I listened for a good 45 seconds to a minute there. OK. So you listed all of the injustices that have happened to the African-American community and you are absolutely correct. There are problems that need to be addressed. But the point is, this community has turned out to the tune of 96 percent and trusted Democratic presidents for the last four decades to remedy the ills that they face and the injustices they face. What will Hillary Clinton do that is different than what Barrack Obama did to remedy the ills of this community?
SELLERS: I think -- can I start? OK.
MCENANY: What is different? What is different?
SELLER: I mean, we could talk about college affordability and historically black colleges and universities. And the best thing in it, Donald Trump hasn't said historically black colleges and universities one time. We can talk about criminal justice reform, while Donald Trump is talking about law and order. We're talking about actually having independent adjudicators when you have violent police brutality interactions.
We're talking about body cameras. We're talking about ending the funding of these private prisons or contracts with these private prisons and criminal justice reform. We're talking about going into these poor communities investing in science, technology, engineering, and math. We're talking about these things. Donald Trump, all he can say is, you know what, this was a ...
MCENANY: If that is different from what Barrack Obama has proposed, not of it addresses that ...
MCENANY: Yeah, yeah, exactly. He had eight years and none of these ...
SELLERS: So, are we trying to say ...
SELLERS: ... that we don't -- with the Republican House and Republican Congress, but we have more African-Americans that have insurance today. I mean, I'm so sick and tired of sitting here and people like to say what has Barrack Obama done for the African- American community? Tons.
MCENANY: Your party has failed this community.
QUINN: No, no, no.
QUINN: That is not true.
BUMP: One point I would make is that I also can't help but see this somewhat condescending to say black Americans you've been voting for Democrats for 60 years, against your own best interests. You don't understand that this is bad for you. And now, I'm here to tell you that ...
MCENANY: No one is saying that. No one is saying that.
BUMP: No, that's exactly what he just said. He just said you've been voting for decades for Democrats and they chose to vote for those Democrats.
MCENANY: The politicians they have trusted have failed them. I would say the same ...
BUMP: But they keep voting because they like them and ...
MCENANY: I would say the same for Republican voters. I have voted for politicians for decades that has failed me ...
COOPER: But does Donald Trump -- OK. But my question is -- I guess is Donald Trump went to Detroit, spoke to a largely white audience about African-Americans, did not go to any part of Detroit to actually a black church, to an inner city neighborhood. I mean, does he need to go beyond just speaking to largely white audiences about African- Americans and actually go to an African-American church on a Sunday and speak or interact in some way?
MCENANY: Donald Trump spoke to a national audience when he spoke in Detroit. And just last week, an African-American church actually endorsed Donald Trump and his surrogates were there.
COOPER: But does he actually need to go to one that he needs ...
MCENANY: His surrogates were at this church speaking in this church.
SELLERS: How about this. Will he come to my community? Will Donald Trump actually be seen in the communities that you are talking about? Because Donald Trump has all of these.
SELLER: And I wish, I wish -- I want to hear what he has to say because, you know what he did? And I think you gave him a lot of credit, Anderson, by saying he spoke to African-Americans. What Donald Trump said tonight is ...
(OFF-MIC) SELLERS: ... you've been voting for Democrats. What are they -- you know what, give me a chance. There's no substance. There's no there, there.
QUINN: And well, I just want to underscore that, you know, everything Barack Obama let the African-American community down. Let's not forget, Barack Obama was in his presidency working against the firm unyielding opposition of the Republicans who tried to kill every advance forward.
[21:15:06] So to put that on the heels of Barack Obama is absolutely inaccurate. And I just want to add to ...
SELLERS: In my brother's keeper. I mean, we can go on and on and on. We can talk about African-American dropout rates. I mean, we can talk about a lot of things that Barack Obama has done.
MCENANY: Yes, but again ...
SELLERS: I mean you may not be in tune to those things. Those are helpful issues.
ANDRE BAUER, TRUMP SUPPORTER: The numbers are not helping him. I mean, most people don't realize if they look back in history voting rights, civil rights, Martin Luther King holiday, all done under Republican leadership.
Look, one of our own party chairman in South Carolina, you know what he said? He said, I don't want to own the black vote. I just want to rent it for a day. So we can laugh if we want. They've taken it for granted for way too long. I didn't misstate that. You check the facts.
SELLERS: That is a fact.
BAUER: It's appalling that it continues to be this issue where they don't think Republicans look after them. They do. I was a Republican ...
COOPER: But wasn't that part of the whole autopsy of the last election that the Republican Party was going to reach out? They were going to make more inroads in the African-American community and Donald Trump, other than hiring Omarosa ...
MCENANY: That's what they're doing.
COOPER: ... to be his community outreach ...
(CROSSTALK) MCENANY: Donald Trump, when he is saying politicians have failed you African-American community, he's also failed me. They failed me. I voted to empower Republican politicians that did not do what they told me they were going to do when they went to Washington. His message is not just about African-Americans or Hispanics, it's about all Americans. Politicians have failed us. Barack Obama has failed us. And in some ways, George ...
COOPER: I want you to respond then we got to go to break.
QUINN: You know, look, there is nothing in Donald Trump's record from, you know, not paying small business people, many of them who were people of color, from not supporting, you know, a greater effort around free college education, for being completely all over the place and say -- saying we don't need an increased minimum wage. There's nothing he said that speaks to the needs of low income communities which are mostly communities of color. And I find it incredibly offensive for him to basically say you have nothing to lose.
I work a lot with women of color who are homeless and even though they don't even have a home, trust me, they have a lot to lose if things get worse for them. A lot. And I find it offensive to think just because someone is of color and perhaps low income, they have nothing else in their lives and that's what he said.
COOPER: We got to take a quick break. Coming up next, Donald Trump putting $4 million to ad money into a string of key states. His first big buy of the campaign. Question is, will it buy the results he needs? John King breaks it down in dollars and votes.
[21:21:02] COOPER: If you live in Florida, Pennsylvania, North Carolina or Ohio, get ready for a Trump blitz on your television starting this weekend. Donald Trump has started buying ad times in those states with Virginia also in the works. Four million dollars of ad time so far. The question is whether that will translate into votes in some states where he's lagging behind Hillary Clinton. Inside Politics anchor John King is back to break it down by the numbers.
So these states that Trump is focusing on, they're basically traditional battleground states, right?
KING: They are, Anderson. There's nothing novel about this strategy. It does underscore the narrow window that steep though Donald Trump has. He has fewer choices than Hillary Clinton does. She wants to keep this map. This is 2012 Obama/Romney. Donald Trump has to change some.
So, let me just focus on those states you just mentioned. Florida, about one circle around Virginia and North Carolina and one circle around Ohio and its neighbor, Pennsylvania. They're traditional presidential battlegrounds. We talked a lot about them every four years.
Let me just show you why we do. This is 2012, Obama wins four of the five. Romney won North Carolina. 2008, Obama wins five of the five. Wins a big margin. 2004, the last time a Republican won the White House, George W. Bush won four of those five. So those five states are your biggest traditional battlegrounds. And Hillary Clinton has so many advantages in the electoral map in 2016. Donald Trump wants the big prizes, 29 votes here, Electoral College, 20 votes there. He's going for the big prizes. He has very little room for error Anderson.
COOPER: What's the state to play in those states now?
KING: That's what gives you the little room for error. Again, Donald Trump probably needs to win four of these five. And look at it right now, Hillary Clinton up four on average. This is the real clear politics average, up four in Florida, two in Ohio, four in North Carolina, 11 in Virginia and nine in Pennsylvania. So it's a steep hill for Donald Trump.
Let me quickly just switch maps though and show you. Remember, the states where it was narrow. This is where we have the race right now, 236 for Clinton, 191 for Trump. It was pretty close in Florida, right? So if Donald Trump can stay disciplined, we saw an example of trying that tonight, Florida was pretty close, if he can get Florida. North Carolina was for Romney, it's pretty close right now, if he can get North Carolina. Ohio's pretty close right now, it is the state Republicans always need to win. There's three of those five states.
If Donald Trump could win those three, they're the easiest. I'll put that in quotes. This is not an easy lift. He's behind. But they are the more conservative, more Republican states. But if he can get those three, it gets him to 253 and this, Anderson, is where it gets extra hard.
Virginia, that's where Hillary Clinton's running mate is from. She's up 11oints right now. Pennsylvania, she's up nine or 10 points there, hasn't voted Republican since 1988. So Donald Trump, smart to pick those five states, but even if he can get the three easiest, still got a lift after that.
COOPER: The T.V. ads that they're starting to roll out, they're little late to the game, aren't they?
KING: They're a little late to the game and they're also not spending a ton of money just yet, but this is something Republicans have been urging Trump to do. And you mentioned, even though they list these five states, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia, North Carolina and Florida haven't bought any time in Virginia yet. Watch that one. There are a lot of Republicans who think that one might actually be out of reach because of the Tim Kaine selection, because of the Democratic shifts in Virginia. Let's see if they actually buy ad time there or if they go for Florida, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and then start looking elsewhere for the rest of the votes, places like Iowa, Nevada is very surprisingly close right now. So, keep an eye on Virginia to see if they actually -- they'd said they're going to invest there, let's see if they do.
COOPER: All right, John King. John, thanks very much.
Just ahead, late reaction to Donald Trump's speech from some people in the crowd. And later, breaking news from the Clinton campaign, big changes in what's become a punching bag for Republicans, the Clinton Foundation.
[21:28:19] COOPER: Donald Trump's speech tonight certainly got our panel talking. The question now, what did the crowd tonight in Charlotte think of what they heard and the campaign shake up that preceded it. Our Gary Tuchman tonight reports.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Make America great again.
GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Changes in the Trump campaign leadership, but no changes in the festive mood of people waiting to get into a Trump rally.
How long have you been a Trump supporter?
DAN WALLACE, TRUMP SUPPORTER: Since day one.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm always liked Donald Trump. And I always said he should run for years.
RAYMOND REYNOLDS, TRUMP SUPPORTER: Nothing's going to change my mind. I'm voting for Trump.
TUCHMAN: But those comments here in North Carolina don't mean all the supporters think his campaign has been flawless, on the contrary.
REYNOLDS: He needs to kind of think about things before he says them. Because I know what he means but sometimes it comes out the wrong way.
TUCHMAN: So you think that he's giving himself some self-inflicted wounds?
REYNOLDS: Yeah. I think so. I mean, I think that he would be in a lot better shape in the polls if he would just kind of think about things before he says them.
TUCHMAN: Some people are saying this is a shakeup of a troubled campaign. The Trump campaign is saying no, we are just adding people. What do you think?
WALLACE: You know, I don't think it's a shakeup, maybe, but I think it's a good thing. Even politicians, even the president, I think he should be open to new ideas, new approaches.
TUCHMAN: Donald Trump has declared "I am who I am." But if he is who he is, what do his supporters think about who he was and who he will be? This is a common sentiment.
PHILIP EZZELLE, TRUMP SUPPORTER: Everyday you're going to see more and more change and you're going to see him getting better at what he's doing. And he was already good enough when he was off the cuff back many months ago and knocked out 16 supposedly smartest Republicans has ever run.
[21:30:00] TUCHMAN: And when it comes down to it, most of the people we talked to had this advice for Trump's new campaign gurus, "Let Trump be Trump."
MATT HOWEL, TRUMP SUPPORTER: I think he'll come back to be more of himself, little more unplugged.
JIMMY AIKENS, TRUMP SUPPORTER: I would rather see him say, you know, what's on his mind rather than, you know, read from a teleprompter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe he needs to be more aggressive.
TUCHMAN: Do you think Trump needs to be more aggressive in the days to come on the campaign trail?
MICHAEL OAKS, TRUMP SUPPORTER: Yes.
TUCHMAN: What should he be doing?
OAKS: Nailing Hillary on her facts and her truths which she don't have one.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: What did the people in the crowd you talked to say about his comments about regret? And I think we just lost you. Oh, well that's happens in live T.V.
We got a lot more ahead tonight. Some fascinating developments obviously out of Brazil on a night full of breaking news. Here is even more breaking news. We'll have more from Brazil. But also, the Clinton Foundation says it's not going to accept foreign or corporate donations if Hillary Clinton is elected. Bill Clinton says he won't be giving any paid speeches. His last was in November. Since leaving the White House, he's given 644 paid speeches for a total of $133.7 million.
Joining us on that story, CNN's Joe Johns with all the details.
So, first of all, the Clinton Foundation, what does this mean that both short term and long term that they'll no longer accept foreign and corporate donations if Hillary Clinton wins?
JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, Anderson. It means a lot of changes. Clearly, part of the concern here is about the appearance of cronyism and conflicts and how to avoid them if Hillary Clinton is elected. So they say no foreign donations to the Foundation if she wins, no corporate donations. And part of this is spurred by concerns about even the suggestion of pay to play arrangements between the State Department and the Foundation. The Clinton camp has been forced to issue denials about big money donors trying to get access.
But there's more to this. The upcoming meeting of the Clinton Global Initiative in New York next month is to be the last CGI brought together leaders from all over the world to talk about solutions to sometimes intractable problems and it also appears that Bill Clinton himself is taking on some of the same burden too. A spokesman says "He won't do paid speeches if his wife is elected." And by the way, he hasn't given a paid speech since November of last year and says he won't give any between now and Election Day, Anderson.
COOPER: I mean, what I don't get about this, I mean, she was secretary of state, they were accepting foreign donations, they claimed, "Oh, there was no problem with that then." Now they're saying, when she's president, they're not going to do it. Certainly, raises questions of well -- I mean, I get that it's the appearance of impropriety, but you would think they might have thought of what that when she was actually secretary of state. The RNC was quick to attack Hillary Clinton on the announcement. What did they say?
JOHNS: Yeah, it's an understanding that they are vulnerable, Anderson. The RNC Chair Reince Priebus, continuing with the Republican line of attack that there still is something suspicious here in linking it directly to Hillary Clinton because she's running for president. He put out a statement asking, "if everything was above board when Hillary Clinton ran the State Department as the Clintons have said, then why change a thing? But now that they have admitted there's a problem, the Clinton Foundation should immediately cease accepting foreign donations and return every penny ever taken from other countries." So, Rrepublicans definitely see an issue here and they continue to raise the question of conflict of interest at the very least. Anderson?
COOPER: All right Joe Johns. Joe, thanks.
We got a brand new development in the Ryan Lochte saga. As I mentioned, two of the three other swimmers detained in Rio are now on their way home. Late developments on that, next.
[21:37:31] COOPER: New details continuing to emerge in the Olympic size controversy involving Ryan Lochte and three other swimmers from Team USA. What we know right now, just in the past few minutes we found out that two of the swimmers are at the airport in Rio, getting ready to leave after spending hours with police this afternoon.
Lochte beat them out of Brazil. He's already back in the United States. Brazilian police say that Lochte and three other swimmers were not robbed at gun point as Lochte said. They were actually caught vandalizing a gas station, urinating outside and Lochte was drunk and belligerent.
There are new questions tonight about the security camera footage and about what happens next to Lochte and his teammates. Our senior international correspondent, Nic Paton Walsh is in Rio.
So, local police there say there was no robbery. What's the latest?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. But at the same time, too, we're hearing from sources close to the four swimmers who say (inaudible) the man and actually they're focusing on what they say is a three-minute hole in the time codes in the footage from that gas station in which they suggest may be the moment in which the man who seems to be a security guard leaning into the car may have used a firearm in order to pressure them to give over money. That's why this was a robbery in their mind.
And they say the CCTV actually corroborates Ryan Llochte's original story. I have to say we've been through the footage ourselves and it is complete, there doesn't appear to be a three-minute hole anywhere. But it is hard to tell exactly what moments you can visibly see some sort of firearm. It doesn't provide an open and shut case backing up as far as we can see Ryan Lochte's situation. But now, we've got these two very juxtaposed stories. Brazilian police saying they were drunk, there were vandals, actually sources close to the swimmers accept they did urinate behind the building there, maybe took a poster off a wall.
So, the stories aren't too far apart. They just diverge about what happened in the taxi where the security guards whether or not money was taken off them and they were threatened with firearms. That's key here. But now, we only have, it seems, James Feigen, likely somewhere in Brazil. We know he was talking to police at an undisclosed location in the past few hours also.
When three of the four are out of town and we're hearing police now suggesting they're not (inaudible) about press charges. In fact, one official saying it wasn't really a crime, that might be applicable for. We're just dealing with an international sized embarrassment frankly for probably the swimmers, too, but also Brazil. This was some degree an episode they really would have preferred to have avoided. But now they're caught in some weird public battle frankly, between very high profile American athletes and their own public image on one side they're trying to defend. Anderson?
COOPER: So, the one swimmer who is still going to be there because the two we're told are about to board a flight out of there, does the Brazilian authorities still have his passport, do we know?
[21:40:05] WALSH: At this stage, yes, I believe that was requested by the search and seizure warrants and the two men who were leaving, presumably have got their passports back because they were taken off them just last night when they try to leave the country for the first time. We don't know if they're going to be successful trying to leave the country tonight, but I can't imagine after meeting the police today they're necessarily going to try leaving without being assured that they'll be OK.
But still, there is this strange moment here for Brazil where the commonness of street crime here seemed to have a very high profile victim, then his story didn't stand up to a lot of scrutiny. He's got a lot of very strong representatives saying actually this was still armed robbery with people dressed as police. But still, we're left with a very confusing picture. An embarrassing moment for everyone concerned, Anderson.
COOPER: Yeah, no doubt about it.
Nick Paton Walsh. Nick, thank you.
As we mentioned, Lochte is already back in the U.S. Martin Savidge joins me now from Charlotte, North Carolina.
Has anyone seen or heard from Lochte since he arrived back home? I understand he was on Twitter, is that right?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right. He's been seen actually on social media. And sources tell us that he probably took the overnight flight similar to what the athletes are taking tonight only he would have taken it on Tuesday and arriving here in Charlotte where he lives early Wednesday morning. But since that time, it appears that he has been keeping an extremely low profile.
We're outside, I guess, you should say of the neighborhood where he lives. It's a gated community so we can't get inside. We actually were able to get in for a time and knock on the door. We didn't get any answer.
I should point out his car has been seen by people here a couple of times. It's a very distinctive car, a black Rolls Royce but no one could tell if he was actually inside. Many here though would like to hear his side of the story, as would we, Anderson.
COOPER: And have you talked to neighbors at all? I mean, does he have a lot of support there? What are people saying about it?
SAVIDGE: There are two kind of things you get from neighbors here, which is one, I don't want to talk to the media, or you find there are others who've been following this saga very closely and have been following their neighbor very closely, actually, for some time.
He's lived in this subdivision for about six to eight months. Though one woman who we were talking to that had seen him said that the last time she saw him was a couple of weeks ago, so before the Olympics. He was out walking his dog. And otherwise, though, you know, he's said to be a regular fixture inside the neighborhood here.
COOPER: He has had some minor run-ins with the law, is that right?
SAVIDGE: He has. Yes. And you'll kind of understanding they may sort of fit a pattern going back to 2005.
Now, this is his college years and it's Gainesville, Florida. But he was arrested then for trespassing and public urination. 2010, he was cited for disorderly conduct. So, you know, not major crimes but they do kind of seem fitting a pattern, at least, what we're hearing from some out there in Rio.
COOPER: Martin Savidge. Martin, thanks very much.
Lochte and other swimmers could find themselves in some legal hot water over this. Joining me now are CNN legal analysts, criminal defense attorneys, Mark Geragos and Danny Cevallos.
Mark, at this point, I mean, none of the swimmers have been indicted by Brazilian authorities. The police chief is saying they'll decide whether or not to indict at the end of the investigation. If they are indicted, what could they actually end up facing, particularly if they all have left the country?
MARK GERAGOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well they'd have to go through the extradition process which is not easy. And I would be very surprised if Brazil wants this story to keep going on or keep going, so to speak.
I mean, one of the problems with this is people, they can downplay what happened in terms of that Lochte gave or did all four of them gave stories that don't quite comport. But the fact remains that even in any civilized city, when somebody puts a gun in your face and is wearing a uniform and then you're starting to talk about money, that's not extortion, that's a robbery virtually anywhere.
So, I'm not so sure that this is as much as a supposed lie or anything else, as everybody's making it out to be. I mean, if he is admittedly under the influence of something, if he's sitting in a cab, if he doesn't realize at the time that the security guard is pointing the gun at him and telling him to give him money, and that that's in connection with, if you believe it, public urination, I mean, I don't know that he's making the connection. I don't know that that's not a robbery. And so, I'm not so sure that there's anything to indict him over.
COOPER: Danny? I mean, do you see this as, I guess, a potential robbery? I mean, that if it was a security guard who pulled a gun, whether, you know, when they didn't understand what was going on, or?
DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: You know, today, after the Brazilian authorities gave a press conference, I found it kind of funny ...
COOPER: Which I going to say was a confusing press conference.
CEVALLOS: Well, very confusing. Lost in translation and then just sort of the subject matter itself. But, after that press conference, I felt like there were a lot of voices out there saying, "Oh well, now we know what happened."
You know, here in America, we don't take what the police say at a press conference or in an allegation or in an indictment as gospel, as evidence against the defendant. So, we certainly shouldn't do it in the case of Brazilian authorities, who, we have to believe, are somewhat inclined to believe the Brazilian side of the story.
[21:45:08] Now, the other thing I found really troubling with this, Brazilian authorities said, unequivocally, there was no robbery. But they also acknowledged in the same breath that there may have been an instance where somebody demanded money and pointed a gun at the swimmers. Here in America, we have a definition for that. It's robbery. I mean, that's what I found so disingenuous about the -- about that press conference is that they were saying one thing and really, if they weren't ruling out the possibility that by any legal definition at least here in the United States, those swimmers may have been robbed.
COOPER: You know, Mark, if -- you've represent ...
GERAGOS: And Anderson, I'll tell you ...
COOPER: Yeah, go ahead.
GERAGOS: I was just going to say, and the other thing is you have to take this with a grain of salt. Remember, they don't necessarily have the same presumptions that we do here, and you've got a-- this is an inquisitorial system where the judge is driving it and there's almost the presumption of guilt, plus they're motivated by the fact that they didn't like the publicity of a robbery taking place in Brazil during the Olympics. There's a focus there, there was always the concern going into the Olympics that there was crime and crime was rampant. So there is-- you have to, as Dan's echoing, Danny, you've got to take this with a grain of salt. This is not one of these things where you can say, "Oh, he just lied, he made it up."
COOPER: Right. I mean, I can tell you, having spent a lot of time in Brazil, I've been pulled over by Brazilian police. I was strip searched on the side of the road by Brazilian police. So, the same rules do not definitely apply with Brazilian police as police officers here. But nothing was found, by the way. I hadn't actually done anything wrong.
GERAGOS: Wish we have that on video.
COOPER: No one wants to see that. Believe me.
GERAGOS: Where's the body camera for that one?
COOPER: But, Mark, I mean, you ...
GERAGOS: Yeah. I want to see the body cam of you stripping down on the side of the road.
COOPER: All right, I shouldn't have mentioned it. But Mark, you represent a lot of high profile clients. I mean, there's a legal aspect and then for Ryan Lochte, certainly, there's the issue of his sponsorships and stuff, which I mean, if he's driving around in a Rolls Royce I assume he makes a certain amount of money from sponsorships. What would you advise him? I mean, should he just apologize? Should these other swimmers just apologize for whatever the miscommunication was and move on? Or just stay silent?
GERAGOS: Right. This is -- yeah, I mean, it's a great question because you've got something here where it is a perfect example of the intersection between crisis management and legal jeopardy. This is one of the biggest problems as a criminal defense lawyer when you're representing somebody in a high profile case that you have to deal with. Here, he doesn't want to acknowledge, no matter what the agent or anybody else is telling you, you don't want to get in there and say, "Yeah, I lied" or anything else because you expose yourself to legal jeopardy. At the same time, you know, endorsements for these guys, I mean, it's not like there's a professional swimming team out there that's going to pay him the millions or tens of millions of dollars and next to Michael Phelps, he's probably the second most marketable swimmer around from the male standpoint, at least. So he's got $10 or $20 million immediately that is in the kind of in play.
GERAGOS: So, one of the things you're going to do is craft something or being doing negotiating with the authorities down there to say if there isn't a mutual way to save face for them, because they're invested now after that press conference, which I know you guys said that it was confusing, I think that's charitable. I think it was absolutely bizarre.
COOPER: I get, though, why Brazilian authorities and people in Brazil are offended by this, because you know, if Ryan Lochte is essentially playing into all the stereotypes that exist about Brazilian and if somebody who goes there a lot. I'm a big fan of the place. But we got to leave it there.
Mark Geragos, Danny Cevallos, thanks so much.
Just ahead, a heartbreaking image from Syria of a boy who's grown up knowing only war.
[21:52:37] COOPER: Tonight a stark reminder of war horror. A little boy caught on video after he was pulled out of the rubble of his home following an air strike in Aleppo Syria. Five year old Omran Daqneesh covered in dust sitting and shocked alone in an ambulance, no shoes, no tears, wiping away the blood on his face.
War is all of this little boy has known five years ago, today President Obama called on Syrian President Bashar al-Assad to step down, five years ago Omran and his family and millions of other Syrians are so wondering if peace will ever return.
Nima Elbagir will joins us tonight with more. Nima, the images of this little boy are so heart breaking. What do we know about him so far?
NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We actually managed to speak to the cameraman who shot that footage. And he was part of the rescue operation to pull Omran and his family out from under that rubble. It took them nearly an hour. That little boy was under the rubble of his home, the wreckage of what had been his home for almost an hour alone.
And even then, Anderson, he didn't cry. And he didn't cry when they pulled him out and he watched him sit in that ambulance still not crying, even though in those images you're seeing, he still doesn't know if his mother and his two siblings, his brother and his sister, if they're alive.
And what the cameraman told us was really so heartbreaking. He said to me, you could tell he was traumatized but it's also that he's five years old. This is all he's known. This is what we tell our children when the planes go overhead. We tell them not to cry and it seems that this little boy, this is a lesson he's really learned, Anderson.
COOPER: I mean, he, as you said, he's five years old, I guess around 5 years old, almost as old as the war itself. This is all he's ever really known.
ELBAGIR: Yeah. This is. And the fact that he and Alan Kurdi who's image also arrested the world last year, that they are children of the conflict, that Alan Kurdi would have been four years old this year. This is all they've known. And for a child's response when he touches his face and comes away with blood to be just -- silently wipe that away, it was just piercing.
COOPER: Do we know what has happened to his family?
ELBAGIR: His mother and his brother are very critically injured and it is the reality of the complete deterioration and disintegration is effectively of the health care system, at the health care infrastructure in Aleppo.
[21:55:05] They can't be smuggled out, taken elsewhere to continue to try and get them the medical care they need. They're pretty critically injured.
But his sister, we understand, is doing a bit better. And Omran himself amazingly, he had to have stitches, which even then the doctor who treated him told us he did not cry through. He had to have stitches but he's now been released to his family.
COOPER: You know, I mean, it's -- people have responded to these images of him as they have in the fact -- in the past, but the fact is more than 4,500 kid have died in this area in northern Syria and, you know, countless others have died as well and much of the world hasn't paid attention.
ELBAGIR: And even when they do, even when we do think it is a moment when the world pauses, as they did with Alan Kurdi, it's very quick for us to return to business as usual. And this was what the staff or the cameraman told us when I asked him, did you know in this moment that this would be something that would capture the world's attention? Did you -- do you hope that this will change thing? And he said to me, Omran and thousands of other, Omran exist, this was just a moment, this is the moment that we relive again and again in Aleppo. And the heart breaking thing is that they really no longer trust that these moments will change anything in terms of their reality on the ground. Anderson.
COOPER: Yeah, of course, (inaudible). Nima, thank you so much. We'll have more ahead. We'll be right back (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:00:13] COOPER: Well, that's it for us. Thanks for watching.
"CNN TONIGHT with Don Lemon" starts now.