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ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT

Trump, Carson Dominate New CNN Poll; George W. Bush Blasts Cruz's Presidential Bid; Biden Splits From Clinton on Working With GOP; Trump, Carson Request Secret Service Protection. Aired 7-8:00p ET

Aired October 20, 2015 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[19:00:08] ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: OUTFRONT tonight, President George W. Bush breaking his silence going on the attack. But you won't believe who he's taking on.

Plus, significant threats against Ben Carson. Will the Secret Service step in?

And we're live on the ground. In the world's most dangerous drug capital. Our Martin Savidge joins the massive manhunt for El Chapo. Let's go OUTFRONT.

Good evening. I'm Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight. George W. Bush slamming Ted Cruz. The former president weighing in on the race for the White House in a big way. This as CNN's new poll shows Cruz and the President's brother Jeb Bush in single digits. At the top, Donald Trump and Ben Carson raising away from the rest of the fields. Trump at 27 percent and Carson right behind him at 22. The rest of the field all below 10. Speaking at a fundraising event for brother Jeb, donors were shocked to hear the former President reportedly say about Cruz, I just don't like the guy. More else on what he said in a moment.

But we begin tonight with Dana Bash. And Dana, this latest poll, Trump and Carson on top again. Is this just the way it's going to be? One of these two is going to be the nominee?

DANA BASH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, unclear if they're going to be the nominee. But at least from the near future until other candidates who were in the lower rung which are most of them drop out and that this sort of the anti-Trump/anti-Carson vote can consolidate behind one of them, it's probably going to be like this. And what is I think most stunning, you put up those numbers, about two-thirds of voters in the Republican Party right now, they support either Trump or Carson as their first or second candidate. Kind of stunning. And also there is enthusiasm for them. It's just to kind of give you context for that, about 30 percent of Trump's voters are enthusiastic about him. Jeb Bush's voters, these are Jeb Bush supporters, Erin, three percent say they are enthusiastic about him. So, that is bad news for him.

BURNETT: That is bad news. And also to your point, if Trump or Carson, you know, between first and second, you get to two-thirds.

BASH: Yes.

BURNETT: You know, to your point raises a question as others drop out. Does that vote go to Carson and Trump? I mean, you know, you talk about people that had their moment. Carly Fiorina had that amazing performance in the debate. She surged. She was getting up there with them. And now I mean, almost lower than anyone.

BASH: The surge is over, at least for right now. It really is stunning, Erin. She is down 11 points. She went from 15 percent just last month to four percent. You see that on the screen. But if you dive deeper into this poll and look at where she has fallen, it's across the board when it comes to the voters. With women she is down 11 percent. With men 12 percent, independent Republicans 18 percent. Conservatives 15 percent. So, it's not great news for her. You know, some people are saying, well maybe it's because she really hasn't been out there. She really has been keeping a low profile, which if you're kind of riding a wave, you want to stay on top of it and not go underneath it.

BURNETT: Interesting. All right. Thank you very much, Dana Bash. And also tonight, we are learning that George W. Bush will be hitting the Washington, D.C. fund-raising circuit. He's going to be headlining an event for his brother's presidential campaign. And this comes as news surfaces that George W. Bush made a shocking statement at another fund-raiser, for his brother in Denver telling a room full of major donors point blank who he doesn't like in the White House. He did not mince words.

And Athena Jones is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): George W. Bush slamming Ted Cruz. The fire brand Texas senator gunning for his own job and running against his little brother Jeb. The former president surprised a roomful of donors in Denver Sunday night saying of Cruz, I don't like guy. So just how concerned is George Bush about Cruz? A man who once worked for him. Cruz even met his wife during Bush's 2000 campaign. When asked about the remarks, a spokesman for the former president didn't deny them, but did say the first words out of President Bush's mouth on Sunday night were that Jeb is going to earn the nomination, win the election and be a great president.

He does not view Senator Cruz as a serious rival to Governor Bush's candidacy. Cruz begs to differ saying in a statement, it's no surprise that President Bush is supporting his brother and attacking the candidates he believes pose a threat to his campaign. While he's trailing Jeb Bush in most recent polls, Cruz is holding his own when it comes to fund-raising. Bringing in $12 million in the third quarter just behind Bush's $13.4 million. Cruz is also attracting some top dollar donors like billionaire Texas brother Farris and Dan Wilkes who have given $15 million to Cruz's Super PAC. And fund- raising will be key if Bush wants a real shot at being the nominee especially in the face of weak poll numbers. And while George Bush is popular with Republicans, 88 percent have a favorable view of him, the campaign says they haven't yet decided how much they'll use him. Jeb dodging the question in Iowa earlier this month.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Will you campaign with him at public events?

JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm happy that he's supporting me.

[19:05:35] JONES: Meanwhile, front-runner Donald Trump is doing his best to make George Bush part of the 2016 story.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When you talk about George Bush, I mean, say what you want, the World Trade Center came down during his time.

JONES: Prompting a sharp review from the former Florida governor.

BUSH: My brother responded to a crisis and he did it as you would hope a president would do.

JONES: For now, Bush's brotherly support his focused on fund- raising online and off. Bush 43 has hosted five fundraisers for Jeb and will join his father George H.W. Bush and mother at a donor retreat for him at the end of the month in Houston.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JONES: So the money race continues. And one more thing about that Sunday fundraiser where George Bush spoke. A donor who was there told my colleague producer Ashley Killough that the crowd there was optimistic about Jeb's prospects, but that everyone understands it's going to be a long haul and a tough fight to win the nomination -- Erin.

BURNETT: That is for sure. Thank you very much, Athena. And I want to go now to republican strategist and the national spokesman for the Bush/Cheney campaign in 2004 Terry Holt. And our political commentator and host of "The Ben Ferguson Show," Ben Ferguson.

TERRY HOLT, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Hi Erin.

BURNETT: Terry all right, good to see both of you. So, Bush is going after Cruz. Right? He said, I just don't like the guy, and at the same fundraising dinner, apparently also said that Cruz is only running for president for personal gain. I mean, these are personal things. It was more than one thing. Bush knows Cruz, Cruz worked on his campaign. And George W. Bush as you know, Terry, is so careful. Doesn't talk badly about anyone since leaving office. So, it makes this really significant. What does he know about Ted Cruz?

HOLT: Well, he's known him for a long time. He can know a lot of things we don't know. He didn't go into it. But ultimately, I'm just so shocked about this. That one Texas politician doesn't like another. It is about par for the course.

BURNETT: It's just not the President's style since he left office. It had to be that, Terry. HOLT: It has been -- you're right about that, Erin. It has been

a long time since we heard too much of George W. Bush's opinions. But remember, he's a very plains spoken man. And he's not afraid to buck the conventional wisdom or public opinion or whatever is in his way of expressing himself. I think that we should remember though that whether or not we think this was a good idea today, he's the last guy in the Republican Party to have achieved the national office, to be elected president.

BURNETT: Yes.

HOLT: So, you may not like it and you may be a Ted Cruz supporter, but he's the last guy that won and everybody else has fallen short. So, I would be cautious before we say that he made a big mistake about this.

BURNETT: So, Ben, why do you think George W. Bush does hate Ted Cruz?

BEN FERGUSON, HOST, "THE BEN FERGUSON SHOW": Look, I think a lot of this is inside baseball that most honest voters are not going to care about. A lot of this goes back to Ted Cruz going to war with the GOP establishment. A lot of it goes back to Ted Cruz going to war and Karl Rove also going to war with Ted Cruz. George Bush is an incredibly loyal guy.

BURNETT: Right.

FERGUSON: That's one of the reasons why I admire him so much. If you mess with his people, he's going to fight back. And Ted Cruz is not only mess with some of his top advisors including Karl Rove, but also he is messing with his brother. And I don't think this was a smart political move. Ted Cruz has made a career off of being the anti-establishment guy. He's been the outsider who wasn't supposed to win that race. He wasn't supposed to have influence in Washington. He wasn't supposed to --

HOLT: And he doesn't.

FERGUSON: He hasn't supposed to have a platform to run --

HOLT: No, he has a platform to run for president. Let me tell you this --

FERGUSON: He walks into a room --

HOLT: Sure.

FERGUSON: But hold on, hold on. All politicians are opportunists. You and I have worked for many of them. They all are saying --

HOLT: I haven't. I haven't.

FERGUSON: They are all are saying --

HOLT: You might have.

FERGUSON: -- that they are going to run for office and be a big person. There's a little bit of an opportunists there. Ted Cruz can fill a room in Texas, he's loved in Texas. Ted Cruz is a threat to Jeb Bush. And I think that what is this poll is down too.

BURNETT: OK. Okay. It maybe but to Terry's point, look at George W. Bush's approval rating, among Republicans 88 percent.

HOLT: It should be.

BURNETT: Among a plurality though, he has got a majority approval rating. I think that would shock some people who still think of him synonymously with the Iraq war and that's it. Right? I mean, he is now a plurality Democrats and Republicans have a positive view of him. Terry, can he really bring in the voters? People going to say, OK, he wants to vote for Jeb. I'm now going to think about voting for Jeb or is Jeb just too much of a dead fish?

[19:10:04] HOLT: Well, leaving aside Jeb and being a dead fish for a minute, let's just, you know, go back to the poll and then his numbers earlier. George W. Bush is not Ted Cruz's problem. Donald Trump is. Ben Carson is. The wing of the Republican Party that he's been appealing to with his shutdown the government, anti-immigration, you know, marginally racist remarks about American Latinos, this is a guy who's been big-footed by Donald Trump. George W. Bush is not his problem at this point, Erin.

BURNETT: Ben, Donald Trump keeps going after Jeb Bush. Let me just get to Terry's point. Give you a little bit of a snippet.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I watched Jeb Bush yesterday. He can't even put on a tie and jacket. He's running for president. This guy can't negotiate his way out of a paper bag. He's terrible. He's terrible. He's weak on immigration.

Let's assume a very low-energy person, very, very low energy, so low energy that every time you watch him you fall asleep. So let's say Jeb becomes president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: All right. All right. Ben, Jeb Bush is the only major GOP candidate in this poll that Republicans have an unfavorable view on. Donald Trump likes to take personal credit for things like this. Is it partly true if people internalized all these things from the likes of Donald Trump?

FERGUSON: Well, I think part of that but also this election is about being non-establishment candidate. And many people believe that Jeb Bush was Mitt Romney or John McCain 2.0. He was the establishment's pick. And I also think he made a big bad decision early on. He should have come out with his brother I think more in public. He should be out there on stage with him. He should be traveling with him as much as his brother is willing to. Because people love George Bush. They really do. Especially conservatives. They still love him. They love him for how he protected us after 9/11. I think as soon as those cheap shots were taken at Jeb and, you know, George Bush by Donald Trump, they should have been on TV together doing an event together --

BURNETT: Right.

FERGUSON: -- talking out in public.

BURNETT: Oh, come on.

FERGUSON: I think it's his biggest asset, he should use it.

BURNETT: All right.

HOLT: Donald Trump is pushing everybody out of the race because he's a celebrity star that insults people personally.

FERGUSON: You and I agree on that.

HOLT: That my president did fall into that trap today, but ultimately this election cycle with Donald Trump in it, he's the thing that everybody has to come to reckon with. And this today, Ted Cruz got maybe a little bump out of it because somebody important mentioned him.

BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, both of you.

FERGUSON: Thanks, Erin.

BURNETT: And next, live pictures as we are standing buy for Joe Biden, he's going to be speaking live in Washington. Obviously, every word he says at this point now being monitored by everyone.

And Donald Trump calling for Secret Service. Ben Carson says there have been significant threats against him. What exactly are they? Our report. And back to the future about to catch up with the present.

Jeanne Moos checking out how the predictions have held up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:17:13] BURNETT: All right. You're looking live at the Four Seasons Hotel in Washington. At that podium, Vice President Joe Biden will appear just moments away. He is going to be speaking. Of course, everyone watching every word he says now. And this is coming, as he tells a totally new version of his role in the Bin Laden raid, amidst all the speculation he will run for the White House.

Jeff Zeleny is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Joe Biden spent the day reminding people he's one heartbeat away from the presidency.

VICE PRES. JOE BIDEN (D), UNITED STATES: Best decision of my political career was to join the President.

ZELENY: Flexing his vice presidential muscles like rarely before. Even invoking the killing of Osama Bin Laden.

BIDEN: Everybody went around the room. And there are only two people who were definitive and were absolutely certain, Leon Panetta said go and Bob Gates has already publically said this, don't go.

ZELENY: Old disagreements from the situation room could flare up in a potential democratic presidential race.

BIDEN: As we walked out the room and walked upstairs, I said, I told him my opinion, I though he should go but follow his own instincts.

ZELENY: A seemingly reversal from the role Biden was thought to have played in opposing the raid. Also making it clear he had the last word with the President, not Secretary of State Hillary Clinton who has long said she advised the President to authorize the high- stakes raid.

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I was one who recommended that the President that he go ahead. And his advisors were split because it was a very risky operation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, help me God.

ZELENY: Biden didn't stopped there. He said he had a hand in every decision, even choosing Clinton as secretary of state.

BIDEN: The President said, you have veto right on anybody in this cabinet.

ZELENY: For Biden, time is running short. He has nine days to qualify for the ballot in Georgia followed by deadlines in Alabama and Texas. Even his new polls show Biden in a distant third and more Democrats say he shouldn't run, his campaign-in a waiting roars on.

BIDEN: That's the healthy part.

ZELENY: He said again today he doesn't believe Republicans are always the bad guys.

BIDEN: I don't think my chief enemy is the Republican Party. You know, this is a matter of, you know, making things work.

ZELENY: A not-so-subtle jab at this moment from last week's democratic debate when Hillary Clinton was asked to name her enemies.

CLINTON: In addition to the NRA, the health insurance companies, the drug companies, the Iranians, probably the Republicans.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE) (END VIDEOTAPE)

ZELENY: Vice President is going to great lengths to try and show that he would be the heir apparent to President Obama, not Hillary Clinton. If he runs, he knows that he would need that Obama coalition of supporters that swept him into office twice. The person stuck in the middle here, that's President Obama who may not be thrilled about the idea of Biden running, but one advisor tells me tonight, Erin, he would sit uncomfortably on the sidelines.

BURNETT: All right. I'm sure. He doesn't like to be on the sidelines. And those two against each other would force him there. All right. Jeff Zeleny. Thank you.

And OUTFRONT now, our political commentator and senior former adviser for President Obama, Dan Pfeiffer. And Vox reporter Jonathan Allen.

All right. Dan, so far the narrative has been clear. You know, I mean, at least publically, Joe Biden was against the raid. That's what we keep hearing. The President himself referred to that point of view in a debate with Mitt Romney. In private, you know, you would know, was Joe Biden for it as the version he is now telling it indicates or not?

DAN PFEIFFER, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER TO PRESIDENT OBAMA: Well, I wasn't in the situation room that day when the decision was made. What I think the Vice President was saying is that he told the President that he would back the President on his decision and the Vice President's description is a familiar role I've seen the Vice President play in many decisions over the years. It does speak to the fact that even though he's not yet a candidate, he is now getting candidate-level scrutiny from the press. And he's either going to have to be more precise in how he says these things or he's going to have to get in the race, you know, sooner rather than later.

BURNETT: And in terms of getting in the race, let me just ask you about this, Dan. A new poll shows 30 percent of Democrats want Biden to run. That is a pretty low rate. Forty percent, close to it, 38, said they do not want him to run. Fewer Democrats want him to jump in. I mean, why is this?

JONATHAN ALLEN, REPORTER, VOX: Well, I think number one the Democrats seem to be fairly comfortable with their field at the moment. I think the last 24 hours probably hadn't helped Biden making the argument that Republicans aren't the enemy and that Dick Cheney is a good man as he said earlier today is not a good way to win a democratic primary.

BURNETT: Right. Because he said he works with Republicans. Just, you know --

ALLEN: Right. That is not necessarily the best way to win the democratic primary. You get the Democratic Party excited about you, you heard the roar of approval for Clinton in the debate the other night when she said Republicans were her enemy. BURNETT: Now, it's interesting. Joe Biden could hurt Clinton,

maybe not as you're saying in some ways, but her own husband could hurt her, too. I have to play for both of you something Donald Trump released today about Bill Clinton. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FMR. PRES. BILL CLINTON (D), UNITED STATES: He's a master brander. And he is the most interesting character out there. There is a macho appeal to saying, I'm just sick of nothing happening, I make things happen, vote for me. And I like him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[19:22:28] BURNETT: All right. Dan, what do you make about that? I mean, that is a pretty good campaign ad.

PFEIFFER: Well, not if you are trying either to be the republican nominee, I guess. Look, I think there is a lot of debate about whether Bill Clinton will hurt or help Hillary Clinton.

BURNETT: Yes.

PFEIFFER: I am one who thinks he is a tremendous asset to her. Like, look, when your spouse is running for president, that's always complicated. It's more complicated when your spouse used to be president, but he, but look, when we get down to the voting time here, Hillary Clinton will be in Iowa campaigning, Bill Clinton will be in New Hampshire dominating the press, they're helping her. When she goes to New Hampshire, he will go to Iowa. That is a tremendous asset.

BURNETT: John, do you think Bill Clinton will ever regret any of those words? I mean, one of those actually, I was surprised in an interview with me when he talked about him being the most interesting character in the room. This was by the way, Bill Clinton said that to me responding to Donald Trump saying, his wife was the worst Secretary of State in American history.

ALLEN: Well, I think interesting may have been a euphemism for another word he might have wanted to use at that moment.

PFEIFFER: Right.

BURNETT: Noticeably.

ALLEN: But look, I think Dan is absolutely right. The Obama re- election campaign in 2012 used Bill Clinton perfectly. They used him as a surrogate on the stump. They had him basically on a leash. He was not doing a lot of freelancing. And if they do that, if Hillary Clinton is able to do that for her husband for going out and giving a lot of off-the-cuff remarks to reporters, he ends up being a big asset, as Dan said, being able to go to places she can't during the campaign and basically doubling the presence of the Clinton campaign around the country. That is a huge advantage. BURNETT: Well, this weekend, we'll going to see Bill Clinton on

the campaign trail and George W. Bush. That's going to be interesting. Thank you both.

(LAUGHTER)

ALLEN: Thank you, Erin.

PFEIFFER: Thank you.

BURNETT: And OUTFRONT next, Donald Trump and Ben Carson both requesting Secret Service protection. Ben Carson saying there are significant threats against him. What are they? Our special report.

And on the hunt for El Chapo. Our Martin Savidge is in Mexico tonight on the drug lord's trail. We are live on the ground tonight.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:27:26] BURNETT: Tonight threats against Ben Carson, the republican presidential candidate says, he's sure there have been, quote, "significant threats against him." And now the Department of Homeland Security is reviewing whether to have Secret Service protection for Carson and Donald Trump.

Joe Johns is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRUMP: If you look at the thousands of people, we had 7,000 people. You had 10 protesters.

JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Donald Trump and Ben Carson drawing huge crowds wherever they appear. Both men now requesting Secret Service protection. So far their security left to a small number of private security guards. Former Secret Service Agent Dan Bongino says the agency doesn't require much to justify the need.

DAN BONGINO, FORMER SECRET SERVICE AGENT: The threat stream against Mr. Carson was likely very significant. And keep in mind, it's not necessarily a matter of quantity. It could

just be, and I hate to use the term quality, I don't mean that in a better or worse way, but the threat, one threat from a legitimate terrorist group that's deemed critical is all they really need to say, hey listen, this guy really needs protection.

JOHNS: Campaign spending reports show that Trump spent over $50,000 on security in the last three months. Carson just $2,100. Carson, the only black candidate in the race, appears unconcerned about his security.

BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't feel the need for it, quite frankly, but the Secret Service thinks that I need it.

JOHNS: Trump expressed a passing concern for his security when he visited the Mexican border to take on immigration. And last week the front-runner seemed to complain that he wasn't getting Secret Service protection.

TRUMP: Personally, I think if Obama were doing as well as me, he would have had Secret Service one year ago. I have by far the biggest crowds.

JOHNS: Trump's right in part. The Secret Service began protecting then Senator Obama very early, on May 3rd, 2007, about a year and a half before the election. After receiving multiple threats, many racially motivated. But the burden is on the candidate to ask for protection early in the campaign. Then the Secretary of Homeland Security, along with a Congressional panel, approve the request based in part on some degree of prominence in the polls, actively campaigning and entered in at least ten primaries qualify for at least $100,000 in matching funds, and $10 million in contributions.

BONGINO: Each candidate is going to have a core number of what I guess we call body men. It could be anywhere from five to 20 to 50 depending on if they're overseas.

JOHN F. KENNEDY, 35TH PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So, now, my wife and I prepare for a new administration.

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The assassination of presidential candidate Robert Kennedy during a campaign event celebrating two primary victories in June 1968 moved Congress to expand protection to major candidates. Currently, Hillary Clinton is the only candidate getting Secret Service protection, but that falls under her status as a former first lady. Assuming that Trump and Carson will soon be covered, too, both men are ready, with suggested code names that reflect their style.

BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: One nation.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Humble.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JOHNS: The Secret Service is also authorized to protect the spouses of major presidential candidates, but only within 120 days of the general presidential election, unless there are special circumstances. The federal justification for giving so much extra security to people who haven't even been elected is, quote, "maintaining the integrity of the democratic process and continuity of government" -- Erin.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Joe, thank you very much.

And now, I want to bring in former Secret Service agent, Jonathan Wackrow. He protected President Obama. And Ronald Kessler, author of "The First Family Detail: Secret Service Agents Revealed the Hidden Lives of the President."

Ron, let me start with you. Ben Carson saying he is sure there have been, to his words, significant threats against him. Where do you think they're coming from?

RONALD KESSLER, AUTHOR, "THE FIRST FAMILY DETAIL": Well, first of all, he would know, he would receive them. Mitt Romney, for example, was receiving one threat a day when he finally got Secret Service protection. If it's anything like Barack Obama, it would be racial threats, not necessarily political, but real racists who go on Internet Web sites, and also possibly ISIS or Muslim terrorists who don't like what he said about the president should not be a Muslim, although later tried to walk that back.

BURNETT: Yes, certainly thinks that could be causing these specific threats. He is saying they are significant.

Jon, you've been there.

JONATHAN WACKROW, FORMER SECRET SERVICE AGENT: Yes.

BURNETT: You protected President Obama who was getting, what, 30 threats a day, as Joe Johns was just reporting. I mean, the stress and fear of that situation must have been incredible.

What is the biggest challenge in keeping right now a Ben Carson or a Donald Trump safe? I mean, you've got 10,000, 20,000 people at these rallies.

WACKROW: So, what it is, is there's a balance between the protection that the Secret Service and the public access to these candidates. I mean, they are running a campaign. Their campaign managers are putting them out front into the public to try to give them the greatest exposure.

BURNETT: Right.

WACKROW: The more exposure they have, the greater the threats are going to be that are going to come towards them.

BURNETT: Yes. So, if you are in a room with 20,000 people and Donald Trump, what can you possibly do if someone is intent on doing something?

WACKROW: Well, I mean, there's -- we follow -- the Secret Service follows a very strict protective methodology, whether it's Donald Trump, the president of the United States, Hillary Clinton, any of our protectees, we follow a methodical protection process that ensures that, you know, the public, the press and, you know --

BURNETT: If someone is in the back of a rally like that and pull a gun, you would be able to stop something like that?

WACKROW: First of all, it goes to the protection process which involves a very comprehensive advanced process. It's a very proactive process, working with staff to understand that -- you know, what the events are. We are not letting guns into these events. You know, we are devising a comprehensive security plan.

BURNETT: To have there be no gun at all. WACKROW: Exactly.

BURNETT: Ron, you think Secret Service protection for Donald Trump is long overdue. When he first asked, there were many people who scoffed. You think he's right, how come?

KESSLER: You know, he has huge crowds. He stirs up emotions. That is a sure sign there will be an assassin thinking about pulling off a murder.

And keep in mind, most assassins don't perceive what they do with the threat. The real assassins just do it.

And as Jonathan says, the first thing is to have screening with metal detectors. Have K-9 units, otherwise known as dogs who sniff for explosives. Secret Service agents have sirens, in the case of an emergency. They have counterassaults and counter-sniper teams with heavy weapons. They have a tremendous array of resources private security would never have.

Robert Kennedy did have private security and sure enough, he was assassinated.

BURNETT: Right. Right. They always said going through the kitchen, going away, perhaps that would not have happened if he had Secret Service.

Jonathan, I'm curious, though. When we see these pictures of Donald Trump now, sometimes there is a stage behind him. The picture we showed there, I don't know which rally it was, it could have been the one in Virginia last week, 360 degrees. There are people behind and to his back.

WACKROW: Absolutely.

BURNETT: OK? So, that is something private security would not be able to handle the same as Secret Service?

WACKROW: Correct. The Secret Service goes in with a very methodical process providing protection.

Listen, Donald Trump is a very unique protectee for the Secret Service as he comes on within the next week or so, as he is a very unique candidate during this election.

[19:35:03] So, containing Donald Trump and, you know, everything that goes around him is going to be very difficult for the service.

BURNETT: And you think he'll be getting it in the next few days, it sounds like?

WACKROW: It sounds like they are starting to really ramp up, you know, security for both Carson and Trump, you know, very shortly.

BURNETT: All right. Well, I appreciate both of you taking the time. We'll see if that happens, as Jonathan said, in the next week. WACKROW: Thank you.

BURNETT: OUTFRONT next, ever since his daring prison breakthrough the tunnel, El Chapo's tunnel, the world's most notorious drug lord has been on the run. And we are live on the ground tonight in the midst of the manhunt for El Chapo. A special report coming up.

And a black driver shot and killed by a policeman. His car had broken down on a Florida highway. What happened?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Tonight live on the ground in the hunt for El Chapo, the manhunt under way at this hour in Mexico's drug capital. The world's most notorious drug lord, El Chapo, narrowly evading capture in Sinaloa, Mexico, just days ago. He was reportedly injured after he fell down a small cliff while escaping authorities. El Chapo, of course, has been on the run nearly 100 days after escaping Mexico's highest security prison, through an elaborate one-mile tunnel, the one you see here with this motorcycle, light and ventilation.

[19:40:09] Martin Savidge is OUTFRONT tonight live in Sinaloa, Mexico, one of the world's most dangerous places.

And, Martin, what is the status of the hunt tonight?

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You know, authorities, Erin, believe they are very, very close. You know, I should temper that somewhat because they've been very, very close they said before. But there really is a sense of that. We can't tell you exactly the community we are in for security reasons, partly for our security, partly for the effort to try to track down El Chapo.

But you had to pass through a number of check points, including federal police and marines, and I'm talking about Mexican marines to get in here. So, even though right here on the square, it seems calm, it seems rather normal, there is in the air this deep sense of anticipation and angst. A number of people who are here had to evacuate some of the surrounding communities, some of the smaller villages because of the fighting and the searching that's been taking place. They say it's just simply too dangerous to live back in their homes.

So, I think it is pretty much that this community is expecting something. They are not sure what it will be, whether it will be a peaceful surrender or whether it could turn out to be a very violent fight to bring the notorious criminal into captivity -- Erin.

BURNETT: You know, Martin, you talk about whether it could be peaceful. I mean, obviously, we know there was this close call days ago in which they pursued him and this apparently fell off a cliff escaping maybe on an ATV. I mean, the details I know are a little hazy.

What more do you know about that raid and his injuries right now? How he is able to move around? SAVIDGE: Well, you know, the Mexican government has not come out

completely or made themselves clear on what happened in this raid. It was October 8th. That much we do know. It's been very slow.

And part of that is because it appears the government's embarrassment over the fact that he got away. We know that there were Special Forces, Mexican special forces involved. They spotted Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman. Apparently he was with a child, and they were afraid to move because of the child's safety. Later in the day, they saw him alone. That's when they went in on foot. There was a chase, as you say. He apparently fell off a small cliff, broke his leg according to some authorities and injured his face. But then his bodyguards were able to scoop him up and rush him into the dense wood here. And they haven't seen him since.

Well, I should say that one time he's been spotted in a red Ferrari. Take that for what it's worth.

BURNETT: In a red Ferrari.

SAVIDGE: Which shows that kind of outlandish circumstances here.

BURNETT: That doesn't sound like somebody trying to keep a low profile.

SAVIDGE: Yes. That's part of the thing here. You got to remember, not everybody where we are thinks that he's such a bad guy.

He employ as lot of people. He spreads his money around. Not everybody is hoping that he's going to be captured. And those informants are the ones working against the federal officials that are clearly trying to arrest him. It's a very dicey situation.

BURNETT: All right. Martin Savidge, thank you very much.

I want to go straight to now to Mike Braun, the former chief of operations for the DEA. He spent years tracking El Chapo.

Mike, I'm sure it doesn't surprise you. Martin Savidge was in a region of Sinaloa, Mexico. We are not saying the name of the town for his own safety, for the safety of the hunt. People understand the seriousness of this issue.

And, the point Marty just made -- yes, he's on the run. Yes, they say they're close. But the last sighting was in a red Ferrari. There are people around there who like him, support him and are obviously helping him.

MICHAEL BRAUN, FORMER DEA CHIEF OF OPERATIONS: Erin, no doubt. Chapo Guzman, he owns the field. He doesn't spend thousands or ten thousands of dollars a year. He spends millions upon millions of dollars a year waging very, very successful corruption campaign.

Government officials at the local, state and federal level, including, you know, sadly Mexico security forces, but has successfully corrupted much of the private sector, the communications industry, the transportation industry. There is not a cab driver in that area that he doesn't have on the payroll.

So, it is extraordinarily difficult for the brave Mexican special forces, the marine commandos to effectively identify exactly where he's at and ultimately either kill him or capture him.

BURNETT: In a word, if he is injured, will he be able to get the care without anyone finding out?

BRAUN: Well, you know, that's a good question. You know, look, this is a guy that's been on the "Forbes" list of most powerful men on not one, two but three occasions. When you've got that kind of money, and when you have the internal security apparatus that he's got, you know, I believe he can. He relies heavily on the hallmarks of organized crime -- intimidation, corruption and brutal pervasive -- perverse sadistic violence to get his -- move his agenda forward.

[19:45:05] BURNETT: All right. Mike, I appreciate your time. The red Ferrari sort of says it all.

BRAUN: Thanks.

BURNETT: OUTFRONT next, a black man shot and killed by a police officer after his car broke down. What happened? An OUTFRONT special report.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Breaking news: A Florida Police Department breaking its silence tonight offering new details about the shooting of a black man who was waiting for help after his car broke down. Police say Corey Jones, a member of his church band, was armed when a plain clothed police officer approached him. Jones ended up dead.

Alina Machado is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SYLVESTER "TRE" BANKS, COREY JONES' COUSIN: We don't deserve this. He don't. We just need justice.

ALINA MACHADO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The family of Corey Jones is struggling to understand why the 31-year-old was shot and killed by a police officer after his car broke down on a Florida highway.

FREDERICK BANKS, COREY JONES' UNCLE: My nephew broken down on the side of the road.

MACHADO: It was around 3:15 a.m. Sunday. Jones was on the side of Interstate 95, his brother tells CNN affiliate WPTV Jones called him for help, saying he needed a tow truck. Palm Beach Gardens police say officers Nouman Raja, who was on duty, but wearing plain clothes and driving an unmarked police car stopped to investigate what he thought was an abandoned vehicle on the exit ramp.

CHIEF STEPHEN J. STEPP, PALM BEACH GARDENS POLICE: As the officer exited his vehicle, he was suddenly confronted by an armed subject. As a result of the confrontation, the officer discharged his firearm resulting in the death of Mr. Corey Jones.

MACHADO: But for friends and family who describe Jones as peaceful and laidback, the shooting is raising questions.

DOROTHY ELLINGTON, COREY JONES' BOSS: In a state of disbelief because of all people, Corey -- Corey is not someone that we would think would be shot by a police officer.

MACHADO: Family members say Jones played drums in his church's band.

And according to CNN affiliate WPTV, Jones was on his way home from a gig with the band when his vehicle broke down.

BORIS SIMEONOV, COREY JONES' FRIEND: It's really sad for Corey's family. They lost an amazing person. A really special human being.

MACHADO: The officer involved was hired by the Palm Beach Gardens Police Department earlier this year and is now on paid leave.

STEPP: There are no records of complaints, disciplinary actions or internal affairs investigations against Officer Raja.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BURNETT: Now, Alina, there's so many questions about trying to reconstruct what happened. I know police say that Jones was armed.

Do you know any about what he was armed with at this point?

MACHADO: Well, police here in Palm Beach Garden say that there was a handgun that was recovered from the scene tonight they released a picture of the handgun, which they say was found just outside Corey Jones' vehicle. The police chief also says that record Corey Jones purchased that handgun just three days before the shooting. What police have not said is whether that handgun was actually fired during the incident -- Erin.

BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much. Obviously, that's going to be crucial to this. We'll continue to follow this important story with Alina.

OUTFRONT next, back to the future. Just hours away, looking up here in my clock, we're in countdown mode. What's going to happen?

Jeanne Moos on what the movie got right.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:57:02] BURNETT: When Marty McFly surfaces from his time machine in "Back to the Future II", he sees flying cars and a world without traffic. The year is 2015, the day October 21st, four hours away from now. Wow. Will you have a miraculous commute in the morning or what? What predictions did the movie actually get right?

Here's Jeanne Moos.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's called --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back to the future.

MOOS: But now, the future is becoming the past as the time traveling machine's destination and actual calendar match.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where we're going, we don't need roads.

MOOS: The flying DeLorean might not, but we 2015-ers still do. Flying cars like the aeromobile exist. As a business, they're barely off the ground.

Ditto for the hoverboard. Up until now, they have hardly hovered as people riding seem to do most of the flying off.

The actors who played Marty McFly and Doc Brown reunited.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Self-tying sneakers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm waiting for those.

MOOS: Waiting for Nike to match the movie.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Power laces. All right.

MOOS: An outfit called power lace seems to have the technology, though, they haven't yet tied up the financing, and the lagging laces is being mocked.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put these on.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right. I bet they're like futuristic self-lacing sneaker, right, doc?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, they're called crocs.

MOOS: And this seemed to be a croc as well.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This thing doesn't fit.

VOICE: I'm adjusting fit.

MOOS: It's 2015. There is still no self-sizing, no self-drying.

Remember when Marty McFly ordered a drink?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All I want is a Pepsi.

MOOS: His Pepsi Perfect came with a straw built into the lid. But Pepsi's special commemorative bottle is just a regular twist-

off, with plain old Pepsi inside.

Pepsi created 6,500 of the bottle, selling them for $20.15. Get it in 2015?

"Back to the Future's" most astounding prophecy was this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cubs win the World Series, against Miami?

MOOS: Twenty-six years ago, there was no team in Miami, but there is now, and the forever hopeless Cubs are in the playoffs.

The ride services Lyft is offering free rides for a day in DeLoreans.

Mercedes jumped on the bandwagon with a spot mimicking the movie's floating robot dog walker. In real life, we're dog years behind.

With all this "Back to the Future" hoopla, here's a toast to the past.

How time mcflies when you're hydrating pizza.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hydrate level four, please.

MOOS: Jeanne Moos, CNN --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Boy oh boy, mom, you sure can hydrate a pizza.

MOOS: -- New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BURNETT: If they're right about the Cubs, it will make up for being wrong about everything else, right? Who would have thought that would be the thing that's possible.

All right. Thanks so much for joining us. Be sure to set your DVR. You can watch the show anytime.

"AC360" begins now.