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CNN NEWSROOM

Pope's Favorable Rating Drops; Ben Carson not Backing Down on Comments; Chobani Yogurt Hires Refugees; A Night of Firsts at the Emmy Awards. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired September 21, 2015 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[10:29:43] ALBERT MOHLER, SOUTHERN BAPTIST THEOLOGICAL SEMINARY: Well, I think the biggest issue there is the fact that the Pope has raised all kinds of expectations, some kind of major liberal transformation of the church. And frankly, I think that's probably his agenda.

On the other hand, he is, as a writer for the Boston Globe called him the pendulum pope. He swings back and forth on so many of these issues. And so the Catholic Church continues to teach very traditional views on homosexuality and any number of other issues, continues to define marriage as only the union of a man and a woman.

And yet he have sent signals that have given those in the LGBT community the idea that maybe he's going to liberalize the church on that. You have a host of issues on which he has kind of sent signals to the left. And then he, nonetheless, has not changed the doctrinal substance of the church.

Then he comes along on this encyclical on economics and on climate change and veers far to the left. And so when I heard you say that the Vatican claims it's not political, almost every paragraph of that encyclical is political. And quite frankly, if he's genuinely concerned with human flourishing, the directions he pointed in that encyclical simply aren't going to work. And I think many Americans recognize that.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Well, I did read the encyclical. He kind of like -- he puts climate change in moral terms as far as it affecting the poor and the most vulnerable among us, so we can differ on that point.

I wanted to ask you this though Dr. Mohler, Pope Francis will make history when he speaks before a joint session of Congress. Do you have a problem with that?

MOHLER: I have a big problem with that. As an evangelical Christian and as an American, no Pope of the Roman Catholic Church has ever addressed a joint session of Congress before and for good reason. For most of our nation's history, there would have been tremendous controversy about sending an ambassador from the United States to the Vatican. The Vatican state is really not recognized because it's a state. It's about 100 acres, has less than 1,000 in population. It's because he's the head of the Roman Catholic Church. And when you put it that way, the pretense that this is somehow a

diplomatic visit really falls apart. Pope Francis is here because he's the head of government of a state with less than a thousand people. And, you know, frankly, they would fit in a shopping mall parking lot.

He's there because he's the supreme leader of the Roman Catholic Church. That's the big question. Why would the Congress of the United States join in a joint session to hear one head of one religious group? And I think it's a very, very dangerous precedent.

There's a congressman, Congressman Paul Gosar is his name, he's Catholic. He's going to boycott the Pope's address before congress. And this is what he said in an op-ed. Quote, Media reports indicate his Holiness intends to focus the brunt of his speech on climate change. A climate that has been changing since first created in Genesis. More troubling is the fact that this climate change talk has adopted all of the socialist talking points, wrapped false science and ideology into climate justice and is being presented to guilt people into leftist policies.

So, in line of what you've just said, Dr. Mohler, do you agree with this congressman?

MOHLER: Well, I think he raises some very valid points. He's coming from a different perspective. I'm speaking as a non-Catholic.

But George Will in the "Washington Post" on Sunday made the most important points here, and that is, if this Pope wants to help the poor, he's going to have to do it in a way that actually helps the poor. And if he wants to increase the middle class, he's going to actually have to suggest the policies that increase the middle class and lead to human flourishing.

The policies that he both implies and calls for in that encyclical are, frankly, not going to head in that direction and they haven't anywhere in the world where they have been tried.

COSTELLO: OK, last question. Will you be listening to the Pope's address before the joint session of Congress?

MOHLER: Oh, I'll be listening, of course. And as an evangelical -- my problem is not with this pope, first and foremost. That's more a Catholic problem. My problem is with the papacy and the evangelical concerns about the papacy as you know go all the way back to the reformation. But nonetheless, it's going to make news and we're going to be watching it very closely. I know I will.

COSTELLO: All right. Dr. R. Albert Mohler -- thank you so much for being with me this morning. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, Ben Carson doubles down on his controversial statement that he could not support a Muslim in the White House.

[10:34:10] We'll hear why he's refusing to apologize even as he faces calls to drop out of the Presidential race.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: -- standing by controversial comments that he would not back a Muslim president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would not advocate we put a Muslim in charge of this nation. I absolutely would not agree with that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Those comments from NBC's "Meet the Press" now igniting major controversy; some critics even calling on Carson to drop out of the Presidential race. But a spokesman for Carson says is he not backing down.

Earlier today, Carson's business manager told CNN's Alisyn Camerota, "There's no reason to apologize because the Republican candidate was simply voicing what he believes."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARMSTRON WILLIAMS, CARSON BUSINESS MANAGER: He's thinking like someone who loves America first, who wants to protect America. He understands that there are tenets of Islam that hates Jews, will kill homosexuals, will kill Muslims, do not advocate the belief and value systems that made America into the country that it is today. It may have been an inconvenient truth but it's the truth.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN HOST: Armstrong, you're talking about an extremist radical strain. Not the strain that millions of American Muslims practice here in this country. You know, there are more American Muslims than there are Episcopalians. You're talking about a radical strain.

[10:39:57] WILLIAMS: Dr. Carson was asked his opinion. His opinion was, the timing at this point, he would not vote for a Muslim in the White House. This is why he's not a politician. This is why he's not trying to be politically correct. This is America. It's a place of freedom of speech and you express what you believe.

CAMEROTA: And freedom of religion -- and freedom of religion.

WILLIAMS: No, this is not an issue -- it is not an issue of religion to Dr. Carson. This is an issue of one's belief system of how they're going to govern. Your beliefs, what you believe in, how you look upon people, how you value people, is dictated by what you believe.

CAMEROTA: Armstrong, let me read to you Article 6 of the Constitution, which says that anyone of any religion can serve in public office. Here it is. "No religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust under the United States."

Dr. Carson's belief system violates that part of the constitution.

WILLIAMS: Dr. Carson, Alisyn, as you're alluding to, was not speaking about religion -- not at all. His, like most Americans in their hearts, if they search themselves and they ask questions, if you see what's going on in the world today and what we're becoming as a nation, if you search yourself deeply and ask yourself, at this time in the history of our country, in the question that was posed to him, which he asked and answered truthfully, is that he would not be comfortable with someone who shares the Islamic Muslim faith in the White House.

CAMEROTA: Is Dr. Carson only --

WILLIAMS: If Dr. Carson -- let me finish up -- if Dr. Carson because of his love for America, he is willing -- everything is not about winning the White House for him. It's about standing up for what he believes in, telling the truth, even if it makes CNN and others uncomfortable. It is what he believes.

CAMEROTA: Is Dr. Carson comfortable with anyone other than a Christian being president?

WILLIAMS: It is not about Christian. It is not about Jew. It is not about religion. It is about what one believes and what they will advocate if they become president of these United States. A place that you and I, and I have no doubt about it, love and cherish and wants to protect.

And Dr. Carson is saying what he believes. And he believes it, Alisyn, and he will not take it back.

CAMEROTA: Muslim civil rights groups have called for him to get out of the race. Obviously, that's not happening. But will he sit down with Muslims today to clarify how he feels about them?

WILLIAMS: Only, Alisyn you and others feel that there's something to clarify. You don't need to clarify what you believe in. It is consistent. It is who you are. You believe in America. You love this country. You see what's happening in Europe. You see what is happening in the Middle East, in the world. You see what's happening on our military bases where people use their faith to shoot our innocent men and women who put their lives on the front line.

What is happening to America? If Dr. Carson is the voice that's willing to stand and speak for those Americans who are solemn in their hearts, who don't want to speak this inconvenient truth, then let the chips fall where they may. He believes in telling the truth. You may not like the truth, but it is the truth. And when you tell the truth, Alisyn, there's nothing to apologize for.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: And while Carson is against electing a Muslim president, he says he might be open to voting a Muslim into Congress although there are already two Muslims in Congress.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, a second chance for hundreds of refugees -- a U.S. company's pledge to help to force to flee those homes next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:48:16] COSTELLO: The United States will increase the number of refugees it takes over the next two years as the Syrian refugee crisis gross. Secretary of State John Kerry announcing Sunday the U.S. will begin accepting 100,000 worldwide refugees beginning by the year in 2017. That's a big increase over the current cap of 70,000.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KERRY, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: This step that I'm announcing today I believe is in keeping with the best tradition of America as a land of second chances and a beacon of hope. And it will be accompanied by additional financial contributions to the humanitarian effort, not only from our government but from the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: An American company is offering a new opportunity and a new life for hundreds of those people forced to flee their homes. The owner of Chobani Yogurt says he feels a deep connection to refugees and he's calling on other U.S. business owners to step up and help out as well.

CNN's Cristina Alesci has more for you.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CRISTINA ALESCI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Mustafa Abdelkarim is putting labels on yogurt containers. Three years ago he was running for his life. His village in Sudan was burning.

MUSTAFA ABDELKARIM, SUDANESE REFUGEE (through translator): they killed my father and two of my siblings.

ALESCI: He's one of 600 refugees working for Hamdi Ulukaya.

HAMDI ULUKAYA, CHOBANI YOGURT: My background is the reason that I knew about the refugees and I knew how important it is to be accepted within these communities. It's only possible if you get a job.

ALESCI: Ulukaya started Greek yogurt company Chobani in 2007. A year later he began hiring refugees to work at his upstate New York plant.

Why did you feel a connection to refugees? Because you didn't have that kind of story.

[10:50:02] ULUKAYA: I left Turkey because I was Kurdish and I was very serious about Kurdish rights. A lot of Kurds in Turkey fled the country. Villages were bombed.

ALESCI: Persecution, oppression, fear, these are the common themes in the stories that many of his workers tell. But these refugees are the ones that hit the lottery. The U.N. resettles less than 1 percent of those seeking refuge. The odds are against the millions currently fleeing violence and death in the Middle East.

ULUKAYA: I couldn't believe it. I didn't know. I should have known, even though I was hiring refugees for four, five years. I didn't know how bad it is.

ALESCI: Ulukaya says the system for processing and resettling refugees is in dire need of change and that undertaking will require corporate America to step up.

You're asking business leaders to contribute.

ULUKAYA: I do -- yes.

ALESCI: Why should they?

ULUKAYA: Because we are effective.

ALESCI: The way that you said it suggests that government is not effective?

ULUKAYA: No. It's broken -- right. It's broken? The U.N. is broken. The government is broken. This issue shouldn't have come to this point. It could have been stopped a long time ago.

ALESCI: Big names from Google to Goldman Sachs have already pledged support. The U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees has raised $17 million in donations. But Ulukaya says business leaders can do more than just write checks.

ULUKAYA: Let's face it, the way that you deal with refugee crisis today is the same way that we did in 1940s and '50s. Nothing is the same. Imagine, the refugees has a cell phone, a Facebook, has a group, and you're telling them these rules to follow. The way that they're dealing with this is different than the conditions are on the ground.

ALESCI: And while he's promised to eventually give away about half of his $1.4 billion fortune to support the cause, right now he's donated $2 million for immediate relief. He hopes it will be easier for those like Abdelkarim to start a new life.

ABDELKARIM: In the short time of working here I was able to buy my own house. I'm happy and I'm also helping my kids.

ULUKAYA: There's enough wealth. There's enough knowledge, enough mobility, enough technology, there's enough of (inaudible) this -- there's enough of everything. You just have to act faster.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: Wow. Warms your heart, right? Cristina Alesci joins me now. As wonderful as that story is, there is backlash.

ALESCI: Yes, it's incredible, you know. He's trying to do Chobania is trying to do the right thing and there are groups out there that say his operation specifically hiring this number of refugees actually poses a security risk.

Here's the deal. Not only does he have a plant in New York, the one that I visited, but there's also a Chobani plant in Twin Falls, Idaho. There a group is petitioning to shut down a refugee center that Chobani hires from because they say this will cause increase in terrorism and crimes.

And so, you know, Chobani is now fighting those efforts and I spoke to a local prosecutor's office this morning who said, these are not -- it's likely not going to happen but it just speaks to how much misinformation is out there about what actually happens to these people when they resettle here in America.

Look, corporate America is stepping up. They're writing checks. But his point, Chobani's CEO'S point is they need to do more. They need to bring expertise in business to helping these refugees resettle here in the United States.

COSTELLO: Well, it's terrific story. Cristina Alesci -- many thanks. I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:57:59] COSTELLO: It was a night to celebrate television's best in show. Well, the 67th annual Emmy Awards was one for the record books, literally including history made for African-American women.

Brian Stelter is here to talk about it. Let's talk with the historic moment -- Viola Davis winning.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CPRD: The first African-American to win the lead actress Emmy. This is something that people have been hoping to see going into last night. And she did not disappoint when she gave her acceptance speech. Here's a look.

I apologize for that, I thought we had a little bit of sound. I'll tell you what she said -- Carol. What she said was that, "There's no difference except in Hollywood, except for the opportunities. When there aren't scripts, when there aren't characters created, designed for minorities, then that is the gap. There are the actresses there, wanting to play those roles if they are made for those women."

That was a message you see. Taraji P. Henson -- one of the other nominees applauding last night.

COSTELLO: One of the great things about Viola Davis' winning is she stars in a show where she plays a woman who just happens to be black.

STELTER: It's a great point.

By the way, one of my favorite points, "How to Get Away with Murder", back in a few days. It's going to be a play that's actually going to be great. "Scandal" also back this week.

COSTELLO: Oh, yes.

STELTER: We saw Shonda Rhimes's power and full effect last night on that red carpet.

COSTELLO: OK. So big night for HBO as well.

STELTER: Yes. I think the biggest story storyline actually is HBO's win here, they dominated in a way that they never have before. They are always cleaning up at the Emmys but this year, they won both for best drama, "Game of Thrones" and best comedy, "Veep". That hasn't happened by any network in 12 years. HBO taking on so many prices -- over 14 prizes, that's more than every other network combined.

COSTELLO: That is insane.

STELTER: It goes to show that even with Netflix and Amazon coming up and competing -- Netflix and Amazon still have a lot of do at HBO.

COSTELLO: No better where it leaves -- right.

STELTER: That's absolutely right.

COSTELLO: And just briefly, Tracy Morgan --

STELTER: Making his return last night after that horrible car accident -- car wreck here in New Jersey last year. Back on that stage, accepting that round of applause and that standing ovation from his peers, as he begins his way back to the comedy business.

[11:00:00] COSTELLO: That was awesome. Brian Stelter, many thanks to you.

STELTER: Good to see you.

COSTELLO: And thank you for joining I'm Carol Costello.

"AT THIS HOUR" with Berman and Bolduan starts now.