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FSU Quarterback Under Fire; Hillary Clinton Speaks Out; Cosby Admits Plan to Use Drugs for Sex. Aired 3-3:30p ET
Aired July 7, 2015 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: No. Rather, these are from his own words.
The Associated Press obtained deposition documents stemming from a 2005 lawsuit in which this one woman, Andrea Constand, who was suing Cosby. During a deposition 10 years ago, Cosby admitted that he obtained seven prescriptions for quaaludes, these drugs, for the purpose of drugging women he wanted to have sex with.
And this admission caps a storm of controversy that began really last year. Now, more than 25 women have come forward alleging Cosby drugged and violated them over the course of the past 40 years.
First up, our correspondent here, Sara Ganim, who has been following this for us today.
And when we talk about this deposition here, it's important to what it was he admitted to and what he stopped short of admitting.
SARA GANIM, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: So this was a question and answer between him and a lawyer.
And I want to just read through some of these with you, because the details are really quite important. In one case, he's asked this question -- quote -- "When you got the quaaludes, was it in your mind that you were going to use these quaaludes for young women you wanted to have sex with?"
Cosby answers "Yes."
Then he's asked, "You gave them to other people?"
He answered again "Yes."
Now, later on, he is asked a really important question, Brooke, because in the context of the rape allegations, did they voluntarily take these quaaludes? The question is, "Did you ever give any of these young women the quaaludes without their knowledge?"
Well, guess what, his attorney...
BALDWIN: Jumps in.
GANIM: He objects. They are never able to get an answer from Cosby on this particular question.
They go back and forth and he never has to answer that question, but later on he talks the context in which, from his point of view, he did give quaaludes to other people and he's talking about an instance in Las Vegas. He talks about a woman he met in Las Vegas and says -- quote -- "She meets me backstage. I give her quaaludes. We then have sex."
Now, in the context of all of this, because I think this is fascinating, because the women that have accused him didn't just accuse him of sexual assault. They also said that they believed that they were drugged. A lot of them talked about being handed a drink or made a drink by Bill Cosby and after they took a few sips they began to feel incapacitated.
As you mentioned, more than 20 women have come forward, but this is the first time that we're hearing from his point of view what his defense might be, what he thinks might have gone down. Of course, today, after these documents were released, he had no comment. But he did fight for nearly 10 years to keep these court documents sealed.
He said in court he wanted them sealed because they would provide embarrassment to him.
BALDWIN: But this is big for these accusers, as we have been hearing from them today. Sara Ganim, thank you very much.
For a lot of these women, they are calling this day their independence day. I talked to one woman last hour, Beth Ferrier, who used to be in a consensual relationship with Bill Cosby, who, by the way, also accuses him of drugging her at one point in time and raping her. She says this admission is vindication for all of the time that she was called a liar and I asked her at the very end what justice looks like in this case. Listen, he may never face any kind of time. What justice looks like and what she would tell Bill Cosby right now. Here she was.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: What, in your opinion is justice to you in this situation and, B, what would you say to him?
BETH FERRIER, ALLEGED VICTIM: Oh, my. What can a person say to Mr. Cosby?
You are a monster. You are a vile, severely ill person who has gone and taken advantage of 49 of us and we ask -- we want to come eye to eye with you, Mr. Cosby. We want our time in court. That will be our justice, because we're not going away. And we're each fighting to get our statutes of limitations via our states that we live in, we want to make those changes. That's the justice. That's what we need to do.
Each of us individually have to suffer through, but not in silence anymore, that we are all -- we all share the same identical story, the same piece, that Mr. Cosby alleges that we are liars and drug addicts and alcoholics and whatnot. And it's high time that the world finally starts to look and see directly at Mr. Cosby and that he's the one at fault, not us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: That was Beth Ferrier. Bet, thank you again so much.
Now with me, I have CNN legal analyst Mark Geragos and also with me attorney Lisa Bloom, who represents former super model Janice Dickinson.
Dickinson, just briefly on her background, she says Bill Cosby sexually assaulted her back in 1982 and she's now suing Cosby for defamation after his attorney called her account "a lie."
Welcome to both of you.
And, Lisa, let me just start there in the wake of this deposition being unsealed and this sort of bombshell that we're now hearing from Cosby himself. What is your client's reaction to all of this?
LISA BLOOM, ATTORNEY: Well, Janice's reaction is a little bit different than mine. She says she doesn't feel vindicated and she's not going to feel vindicated until Bill Cosby acknowledges what he did to her and apologizes.
And remember, in our case, all we asked for was for him to publicly retract the statements that he made to thousands of news outlets calling her a liar. That's all he wanted and he refused to do it. And so we brought the defamation case.
My view though as a lawyer is this is extremely helpful for us because now we have him cold under oath 10 years ago admitting to one of the essential elements here, and that is that he planned this, that he planned to get drugs, to give them to women for the purposes of sexual submission and that's one of the key issues in our case.
BALDWIN: So let me just stay with you. We were you talking to your mother, Gloria Allred, last hour, and she was sort of saying, listen, certain lawyers are getting creative because of a lot of these cases are dealing with statute of limitations in which that has long since run up and so you can get creative with these defamation suits. In the end, what are you hoping for?
BLOOM: I'm hoping for what Janice is hoping for, that he will acknowledge what he did and he will apologize.
And Bill Cosby, I call on you today to call off your high-priced lawyers and your spin doctors who have been attacking the women year after year, calling them names, revictimizing them. And to all of the lawyers and spin doctors who are doing that, did you know that in 2005 Bill Cosby said under oath that he was drugging women for the purposes of sex, and, if so, how do you look at yourself in the mirror in the morning?
BALDWIN: OK. Mark Geragos, on the flip side, again, to be precise with this language in this deposition, intended to drug these women for sexual purposes, before that attorney jumps in, when the other attorney is asking these follow-up questions.
Big picture, how big a deal in this admission in your perspective because again he did not admit to giving directly these women these quaaludes?
MARK GERAGOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, it's still a big deal and, frankly, I hate to second-guess lawyers, but if this lawyer was going to tell him not to answer questions, he should have told him not to answer questions before he answered some of those, number one.
Number two, if you're going to settle this case and you're going to seal this transcript, there's ways to get around having that be lodged with the court or having the court have access to unseal it. They should have taken care of that. He has tremendous, tremendous problems right now. I know everybody keeps talking about the statute of limitations, but there are a number of creative ways not just with the defamation actions. That's just kind of a wedge.
BALDWIN: How else?
GERAGOS: He's got immense exposure, especially in California. And so if I'm representing him, I'm telling him, you're not talking anymore, you're not doing anything anymore and you're just going to shut down.
BALDWIN: And so then, staying with you for some of these women who really want to nail him down and see real justice, could you ever see a situation with attorneys getting creative, i.e., perhaps what is happening in California, in which Bill Cosby would actually be arrested?
GERAGOS: I could see a scenario right now where some creative prosecutor uses these admissions and has these statute of limitations and there is at least one or two of the accusers who are still within the new statute of limitations and they could bootstrap it.
Yes, I could. That's one of the reasons some of these legal kind of approaches they have taken are fraught with peril for him.
BALDWIN: OK. Lisa Bloom, Mark Geragos...
BLOOM: And, Brooke...
BALDWIN: Quickly, Lisa, go ahead. Go ahead.
BLOOM: Let's remember that a DA had an opportunity to go after Bill Cosby in 2005. A DA could have looked at this in 2005 when a woman went to the DA and said he drugged me and raped me. He refused to prosecute. He said he didn't have enough evidence.
I don't know what more evidence you need than a statement under oath from the defendant himself saying that he procured drugs for the purposes of sex.
BALDWIN: Lisa Bloom and Mark Geragos, thank you very much. We will actually revisit this a lot of this at the bottom of the hour here and specifically on the issue of quaaludes, so more on that, how quaaludes affect people and what they do and how they can cause memory loss. We will talk to a doctor. That is coming up.
Also ahead, Florida State's quarterback dismissed from the team after this video has now come out showing him at a bar slugging a woman in the face, more on the team's response to this video coming up.
And Hillary Clinton speaking to CNN. This is huge today. This is her first national TV interview since getting into the presidential race. What does this mean for her larger strategy? We will discuss coming up.
BALDWIN: A Florida State University quarterback gets into a fight in a nightclub, punches a woman square in her face. We got the video. We will show it to you here.
This began when 19-year-old De'Andre Johnson on the left side of your screen -- see him arguing back and forth with this woman. Watch his right hand here, because in this next frame, unreal. She initially raised a fist to defend herself, he grabbed her arm, and then she attempted to hit him. And then, as you know saw, one strong blow to her face.
This happened in Tallahassee. This was back on June 24, but the video just released yesterday, the same day Johnson was dismissed from the FSU football team. He's also being charged with battery. His attorney, Jose Baez, said during the interview with NBC's "Today Show" that the woman involved yelled racial slurs at Johnson before he punched her.
I should be clear that CNN reached out to Baez and this is what he told us in a statement -- quote -- "While it's clear from the video that De'Andre Johnson was not the initial aggressor, his family wants to take the lead in helping him learn and grow from this experience. De'Andre is extremely embarrassed by the situation and would like to express his heartfelt apologies to everyone."
Dave Zirin, let me bring you in, sports editor for "The Nation" magazine and host of "Edge of Sports Radio" for SiriusXM.
DAVE ZIRIN, "THE NATION": Thank you so much.
BALDWIN: In reading about this morning, obviously, this whole story makes my stomach turn. ZIRIN: Yes.
BALDWIN: But this woman still has this black eye, swelling cuts to her face. He was initially suspended from the team and then here you go, wham, the video comes out and then the next thing you know, it's the video, right, for this team to do the right thing.
ZIRIN: Sure. Absolutely.
There's an old expression in coaching, that if you want to get the attention of the team, you don't suspend your best player, you kick off your worst player. And De'Andre Johnson was due to be the third, if not fourth-string quarterback on Florida State this year.
And Florida State is a team that obviously over the last two years underwent a rather horrific brand makeover, to being from a sort of middling college football program to being a football program that won national championships, had a Heisman Trophy winner and aggressively protected their star player, Jameis Winston, after accusations of sexual assault.
BALDWIN: Do you think they acted so quickly because of Jameis Winston?
ZIRIN: Absolutely. Absolutely.
ZIRIN: This is a brand rehabilitation issue for the program. They can't put up with this.
Jimbo Fisher is due to make over -- that's the coach of Florida State -- is due to make over $5 million this year, as one of the highest paid coaches in the land. The city of Tallahassee, which is basically a factory town and it's a factory that produces Florida State football, gets $10 million infused into its economy every single home game.
Obviously, that number fluctuates depending upon how good the team is. Under Jameis Winston, not Jimbo Fisher -- notice I said Jameis Winston -- everybody got paid and everybody got rich, ironically not Jameis Winston, although he now the number one draft pick in the NFL.
But at the same time, the brand of Florida State suffered tremendously during this period, exposes in "The New York Times" about police corruption, all of the things that you would be absolutely embarrassed about if you were an alumni of the school.
And whatever you think about De'Andre Johnson, obviously, the video is terrible and upsetting, he's paying for the sins of Jimbo Fisher, of Jameis Winston, and of a Florida State admissions office that has let in players who are prone to commit violent acts.
BALDWIN: This is what we have, Dave, from the FSU president. He says he fully supports the coach's decision to dismiss Johnson from the team, adding that he has no tolerance for this kind of behavior exhibited in this case.
Just given other cases and other schools you have covered, what are the chances that he gets kicked out of school?
ZIRIN: Oh, he is done at Florida State, without question. I mean, like so many -- he's done. At Florida State, he's done and he will probably take a year off, do a lot of community service and then have to convince a lower-level school that he deserves a chance, because even though he was going to be third or fourth string, this was Mr. Florida in the state for football and Florida is one of the most productive football states at the high school level in the country.
Someone will give him a chance, particularly if he shows regret or that he learned. And you notice a tremendous change in what his lawyer, Mr. Baez, the tack he's taking. I'm sure that's because of the family and other advice they have gotten is that, no, they don't want to go ahead and say that this woman deserved to be punched.
Now he's saying he's going to try to rehabilitate himself. Notice his second statement did not mention racial slurs. It mentioned instead about him getting involved in church programs. Clearly, there's a lot of spinning because this is a young man who potentially could be worth millions of dollars in the NFL.
Clearly, there are a lot of people around him and clearly I hope there are people around him as well that will get him to look at issues like alcoholism, anger, and whether or not you put your hands on a woman in such a way.
BALDWIN: You just don't. Dave Zirin, thank you.
ZIRIN: Thank you.
BALDWIN: Coming up next, months after she announced her candidacy, Hillary Clinton is finally giving her first national TV interview. You will see that here on CNN later this evening. Live pictures here, Iowa City. We're watching and waiting to hear Hillary Clinton speak. As soon as she comes out and speaks, we will take it live. You're watching CNN. We will be right back.
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HILLARY RODHAM CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: ... what is on their minds, what out what they are worried about, what they're hoping for.
And I think that's the strongest base on which to build a good campaign heading toward the caucuses. I also think, look, you know, this is going to be competitive. It should be competitive. It's only the presidency of the United States we're talking about. So, you know, the more the better. Let's get everybody out there.
Let's get everybody working hard, running their own campaigns and then we will leave it up to Iowa to decide what happens in February.
QUESTION: I have heard a lot of issues today, specifically the shooting at the Coral Ridge Mall recently. You talked a little bit about gun control. How important of an issue an issue to you?
CLINTON: It's important. It's been important to me for a long time, because I think there is a very clear path to protecting the rights of gun owners and following the Second Amendment, while doing more to keep guns out of the hands of people that should not have them. And I feel very strongly about that.
To me, it's a critical safety issue. And we have seen too many mass shootings in our country. And we have seen too many of the kind of tragedies that you had here just last month.
So, I am strongly supporting it and hoping that we can make some progress on this issue.
QUESTION: The people of Greece rejected a bailout tied to more austerity measures. Do you agree with Senator Sanders, who just mentioned and saying that that is the right way to go or was that a mistake?
And kind of, you know, related to that, do you think that the Obama administration has done enough to help Greece and help stabilize the situation? And on top of that, do you think that Wall Street has been culpable in sort of egging on this whole process, including your own son-in-law?
CLINTON: Well, let me answer it this way.
I think what's happened in Greece is a tragedy. Their gross national product has dropped by 25 percent. They have youth unemployment over 50 percent. People are suffering. Pensioners are really worrying that they're not going to be able to afford food. So, I think it's imperative that there be an agreement worked out with Greece and I urge the Europeans to exert every effort to find one.
You know, Greece is a NATO ally. It's a member of the European Union. The United States has a great, active, successful Greek-American community. So I want to see a resolution. Obviously, at the end of the day, it's up to the Greek people to decide what they're willing to do. And I hope that we can see an outcome here that will actually help Greece recover and keep them in the Eurozone and keep Europe united.
QUESTION: you said in New Hampshire that China was hacking into everything that (OFF-MIKE) in America, including government systems. How should the United States retaliate?
CLINTON: Well, I think, first of all, we have to face up to the fact that we have a serious problem, and it is not only the Chinese. We know that other governments, Russia, North Korea, Iran, have either directly or indirectly sponsored hacking.
We know that groups of hackers and we worry about terrorist organizations getting access to the capacity. And it's obviously -- for me, as secretary of state, it started with the grave concerns that a lot of American businesses had that their most confidential information was being vacuumed up through intrusive hacking.
So, I think, number one, the United States, both our government and the private sector, have to recognize this is a serious threat. It's a serious threat to our commercial interests, to our intelligence interests, to our strategic interests. We have been trying to get a good plan going forward. We're making a little bit of progress on that in the Congress.
It's, for me, not enough. It doesn't go far enough to try to have better coordination between the public and the private sector. And we need to accelerate our efforts to protect government information. And by that, I mean that we have very cumbersome procurement and bureaucratic obstacles within the federal government to moving us into the 21st century.
And, in fact, we saw that a lot with the problems in the Affordable Care Act rollout, because trying to get a contract, trying to work within the constraints of the government, the Congress and the executive branch must work together to clear the way for the use of the best technology we can, both to store and collect, as well as protect our information.
CLINTON: ... gets to call on people.
QUESTION: Secretary Clinton, your comments today responding to the man who asked about the military use?
QUESTION: It sounds like you still have regrets about your Iraq War vote. And I wonder if that creates an opening for Senator Sanders and others to question your foreign policy decisions.
CLINTON: Well, that's up to people to decide.
I have said that I was wrong. And I certainly am willing to not only admit that, but to point out that I think, working with the Obama administration, we did exercise the kind of smart power that I think needs to be the hallmark of our security policy.
So, I think I am very well prepared and very grounded in what will work in dealing in a very complicated world. This is a multipolar, challenging world that we have to get right on so many different fronts. And I think I bring a level of understanding and experience to the race that would do me well in the White House.
QUESTION: Secretary Clinton, do you agree with John Kerry's assessment that Iran disclosing its past military experiment -- experimentation with nuclear technology is less important than curbing future use? And would you agree with an agreement that did not make Iran come clean on its past activity?
CLINTON: You know, Amy, I don't think it's useful for me to publicly comment right now on what the negotiations are attempting to resolve.