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CNN NEWSROOM

Five Dead in Berkeley Balcony Collapse; Tropical Storm Bill Slamming Texas Coast; Al Qaeda Number Two Leader Killed in Yemen; Former NAACP Leader Breaks Her Silence; Source: Inmates Plotted to Kill Husband. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired June 16, 2015 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[09:00:33] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Hi. Have a great day. NEWSROOM starts now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: Happening now on the NEWSROOM, do you know where these two escaped killers are? Right now police don't.

SHERIFF DAVID FAVRO, CLINTON COUNTY, NEW YORK: They had a better plan than her picking them up at 12:30 to take them out of here.

COSTELLO: And sex, a plan for murder? Sources give new details about the fugitives' relationship with the prison seamstress who helped them bust out.

Also, Trump 2016? Is the real estate mogul-slash-reality star serious this time? We're about to find out. What will it take for the Donald to win over conservatives?

Plus --

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Are you African-American?

RACHEL DOLEZAL, FORMER NAACP SPOKANE CHAPTER PRESIDENT: I don't -- I don't understand the question.

COSTELLO: Stepping down, Rachel Dolezal resigns as Spokane's NAACP president over questions about her racial identity.

DOLEZAL: This is not some freak birth of a nation mockery black face performance. This is on a very real connected level.

COSTELLO: But does she owe America more?

Let's talk. Live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

We begin with breaking news. A horrific scene in Berkeley, California, after an apartment balcony collapses just blocks from the campus of UC-Berkeley. Police say 13 people fell from that balcony. Five of them died.

CNN's Dan Simon is headed to the scene. He joins me now on the phone with more on this.

Hi, Dan.

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via phone): Good morning, Carol. What a heartbreaking situation. Obviously there was some kind of party or gathering at this apartment complex late last night in Berkeley. We're told that this occurred just before 1:00 in the morning local time. We had a number of people apparently on a balcony and it just collapsed. As you said, five people dead and at least eight people taken to hospitals.

Now this happened just a few blocks away from the university. We don't know if in fact these were students. But apparently these were all young people involved. And according to the minister of a parish from Ireland, we're talking about young Irish nationals who are among the victims.

So this is really a terrible situation. Police are at the scene trying to figure out how this collapse occurred. But again, just a few blocks away from Berkeley at 1:00 in the morning. There was a party or gathering at this apartment complex and the balcony suddenly gave way -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Dan Simon, we'll check back with you when you arrive on the scene. Thanks so much.

Texas bracing for dangerous weather. The worst of Tropical Storm Bill now just off the Texas coastline. But torrential rain is slamming the already flood weary state. Millions are in this monster storm's path.

We've got Jennifer Gray in Galveston where evacuations are now underway. Chad Myers is in Atlanta, tracking the latest threats but we begin with Jennifer.

Good morning.

JENNIFER GRAY, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Good morning to you, Carol. This is definitely the worst it's been all morning. We get these really strong wind gusts. And the rain is just relentless here on Galveston Island. We are standing right along the sea wall, the 17-foot wall that actually --

COSTELLO: OK. Well, you know what happens when the weather gets vicious, our shot goes down. So let's head to Atlanta to check in with Chad Myers.

How bad will the storm get, Chad?

CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Carol, we're up to 60 miles per hour right now, going toward Port Lavaca a little bit to the southeast of Bexar. That's where the heaviest bands are. Our Jennifer Gray right there. That band just got to that live truck

location there. Every time the rain starts, the wind will pick up. When you're in kind of a rain hole right there, the wind will die off. And so right now she's kind of in a windy situation.

Headed to the north of Corpus Christi. This is where the eye of the center of the storm is right now. Not a hurricane, but very, very strong storm here. And not really a slosh-maker. Not a big storm surge maker. This will be a rainmaker, a very heavy rainmaker in places that have seen almost 20 inches of rain in the month of May.

I know it dried out a little bit in June, but still you get the idea. This ground is still saturated. It will take 36 hours, 36 hours to get to Dallas. That's how long it will be raining across Texas. And we could see eight to 12 inches of rain -- Carol.

COSTELLO: That's just awful. That's awful. We're trying to get Jennifer Gray back up. And you know how that goes. I'm going to ask you another question, Chad. Of course that area of Texas doesn't need any more rain.

MYERS: Of course. Yes. And what I'm worried about, Carol, is the hill country. The hill country is an area that you take with the low lands here from Houston back toward Galveston, and you start to ramp up your elevation, back to Austin and back to San Antonio and Georgetown and Round Rock and Waco.

[09:05:14] You get out here, out here in the western section here, from Dallas through Waco, that's where the ramped up -- this is where the land goes up. And if you put rain on top of that upland, it's going to go down land and it's going to get right back into these rivers that are already saturated. They are not all full because they dried out a little bit, but back to these areas that flooded so badly just two or three weeks ago.

COSTELLO: All right. Chad Myers, many thanks to you. We can't get Jennifer Gray back. Our satellite is being affected by the wind currently. But thank you, Chad Myers, very much.

It's being called the biggest blow against al Qaeda since the death of Osama bin Laden. Al Qaeda's second in command has been killed in a U.S. drone strike. This is the man who ran the most violent and dangerous branch of the terror network and had been plotting attacks against the West for years.

CNN's Barbara Starr live at the Pentagon with more on this. Good morning.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. Nasser al-Wuhayshi said to have been killed in a U.S. drone strike in the last several days in Yemen. The U.S. government not confirming that but several Web site, several Yemeni officials say he has been killed. We'll see if and when Washington decides to confirm that.

Wuhayshi led the most violent group in the al Qaeda organization. This is a group that has vowed to attack the United States, that has somewhat succeeded in trying at least to put explosive devices, bombs on board U.S. airplanes, said to be responsible for that 2009 Christmas Day underwear bombing attack attempt, said to be behind the "Charlie Hebdo" attack in Paris several months ago.

These are really bad guys. So taking Wuhayshi out is a step forward. But already this group has announced a successor, someone that's quite concerning to the U.S. So clearly not down and out. Really interesting. We've had this attack earlier this week. We had a U.S. airstrike in Libya said to have taken out a man named Mokhtar Belmokhtar, the head of the al Qaeda affiliate in North Africa.

We had that U.S. Army Delta Force raid several weeks ago in Syria, took out a key ISIS leader. So the intelligence community has had some successes in recent weeks. To be remembered, they also don't always succeed. There have been some failed hostage rescue attempts recently. And earlier this year the American hostage in Pakistan, Warren Weinstein. He was killed in a drone strike when the U.S. didn't know he was there -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Barbara Starr reporting live from the Pentagon, thanks so much.

Still to come on the NEWSROOM, the former NAACP chapter president accused of pretending to be black is speaking out, next. Let's hear what she had to say, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:12:06] COSTELLO: After resigning, Spokane's former NAACP leader, Rachel Dolezal, is breaking her silence, confronting allegations that she's been pretending to be African-American. Well, this morning she told NBC's Matt Lauer, "I identify as a black person."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DOLEZAL: I would say about 5 years old --

MATT LAUER, HOST, NBC'S "TODAY": You began identifying yourself as African-American?

DOLEZAL: I was drawing self-portraits with the brown crayon instead of the peach crayon, and the -- you know, black curly hair. And you know, it's a little more complex than me identifying as black or answering a question of, are you black or white? I was actually identified when I was doing human rights work in North Idaho as first transracial, and then when some of the opposition to some of the human rights work I was doing came forward and started, the next newspaper article identified me as being a biracial woman.

And then the next article when there were -- there were actually burglaries, nooses, et cetera, was this is happening to a black woman. And I never corrected that.

LAUER: Well, why didn't you correct it? You knew it wasn't true.

DOLEZAL: Well, because it's more complex than, you know, being true or false in that particular instance.

LAUER: But this --

DOLEZAL: As much as this discussion has somewhat been at my expense recently in a very sort of viciously inhumane way, come out of the wood work and the discussion is really about what it is to be human and I hope that that really can drive at the core of definitions of race, ethnicity, culture, self-determination, personal agency and ultimately empowerment.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Cultural critic and writer Michaela Angela Davis joins me now.

And as I was watching that I just became more confused.

MICHAELA ANGELA DAVIS, CULTURAL CRITIC/WRITER: Yes. I mean, Carol, what I was hoping that we would at least hear this morning was to my family, to my children, I am sorry for whatever hurt and confusion this has caused you. To black women, to the thousands of black women who've had to define and describe and defend our very existence because of my one story, I am sorry. Right?

If you -- if you identify with the black experience, you also identify with the sisterhood what this is doing. There was no -- there was no remorse. There was no apology. There was no direct answer to when he asked her about her suing one of the most prestigious HBCU's in this country, Howard University as a white woman. So --

COSTELLO: For discrimination, right?

DAVIS: For discrimination. So this identifying as -- like it was very shape shifty, the whole interview.

[09:15:00] COSTELLO: Well, Matt Lauer did ask her the question about, you know, whether she felt she was put on blackface, this is how she answered the question. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DOLEZAL: I have a huge issue with blackface. This is not such freak birth of a nation mockery black face performance. This is on a very real connected level. How -- I've actually had to go there with the experience, not just a visual representation, but the experience.

And the point at which that really solidified was when I got full custody of my -- of Izaiah. And he said, you're my real mom. And he's in high school. And for that to be something that is plausible, I -- you know, certainly can't be seen as white and be Izaiah's mom.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: OK. So, she brought her two sons to the interview. Both are African American.

DAVIS: Sure.

COSTELLO: She looked at her sons and they looked back lovingly at her. And she told Matt Lauer that he sons consider her human and culturally black.

DAVIS: Right. So, I would like to have had a follow-up question, so how did you have that experience? She said that I had to go there in the black experience. How does that play out? What did that experience look like?

I know a lot of children whose parents are of different race. That's actually what transracial adoption. That's what transracial is in the adoption industry.

This idea that you can switch races, transracial I'm just not here for. You know what I mean? There are so many parents who do adopt other children or have other children that society reads as black. They don't have to become black to be a good mother who is openly white.

You know, you can be openly white and do lots of good race work. As a matter of fact, the most gracious thing a white person can do is share their white privilege. And she couldn't even afford us that.

COSTELLO: Well, the other thing she said that was curious, Matt Lauer asked about her rejecting her own parents, right? And she identified this African American man as her father. And he asked her about that. And she seemed to imply that, you know, he's my dad. You can be a father and a biological father, but this black man is my dad.

So, maybe something happened within her family that we don't know about. I don't know.

DAVIS: I mean, that's a question that I was hoping would come out with this interview, like what is going on with that family? And why are they so hurt? And why does her brother say she's so angry and they hope she gets the help she needs.

So, as I mother, you know, if I would say, I hope my daughter gets the help that she needs, that would suggest that I think that there is some problem. There's some issue, there's some medical issue, some mental issue. And the fact that we never got into those family dynamics, like what did it mean to adopt four other black kids and where do you play out in that?

So, I just -- I just still felt that her interview didn't address anyone that she may have hurt.

COSTELLO: So, in the end, have we learned anything from this besides what was she thinking?

DAVIS: What she identifies as. You know, you were jokingly saying, I identify rich, you know? But I drew myself as purple perhaps, like that does not -- that also kind of negates this idea of people who have really -- you know, the transgender community and particularly black transgender women and the research and the data, and the history, and the case studies that have brought us to this place.

We have one white woman making us all defend our experience. Not one case study, no science, no data to merit this kind of discourse. It is white privilege at a spectacular performance.

COSTELLO: Michael Angele Davis, thanks as always. I appreciate your insight.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM: sex, lives and deadly motivations. New details emerge in the prison escape of two killers in a trial that has now grown cold.

CNN's Alexandra Field has the latest.

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey there, Carol.

Was there a plot to kill wrapped in the plan to escape? That's what authorities are now looking at. We'll have the latest on the investigation coming up right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:23:48] COSTELLO: Tawdry new details, but an agonizing lack of progress, in the search for two killers who broke out of a New York prison. A source briefed on the investigation says the fugitives' trail is now cold in this, the 11th day of the search.

And we're learning the two killers may have had planned to murder the husband of Joyce Mitchell, the prison employee charged with helping them escape. And that threat of violence to Mitchell's husband may have forced her to cooperate with them. Investigators are looking into that possibility as they unravel the tantalizing chain of events.

CNN's Alexandra Field is in West Plattsburgh, New York, with more for you this morning.

Good morning, Alexandra.

FIELD: Hey there, Carol.

Joyce Mitchell is facing serious charges, up to eight years behind bars. But the sheriff says she is keeping her cool and composure in the jail cell over at the Clinton County jail. At the same time, authorities are releasing new details about their investigation into the escape plan. But when it comes to the search effort, the effort to find these two men who'd been on the run for 11 days, well, it's been days since searchers found any clear sign indicating that they could still be in the area.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

[09:25:00] FIELD (voice-over): Closely monitored behind bars this morning, officials say former prison employee Joyce Mitchell is calm and cooperative. As we learn more about her alleged deep involvement with fugitives Richard Matt and David Sweat.

ANDREW WYLIE, CLINTON COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: It's apparent she's trying to be as truthful I think as possible.

FIELD: A source with detailed knowledge of the investigation tells CNN Mitchell had a sexual relationship with Matt. And in the past, she had been investigated for having an inappropriate relationship with Sweat.

JOHN CUFF, FORMER U.S. MARSHALS SERVICE DIVISION HEAD: They'll exploit someone. They'll see a weakness in someone. They'll use whatever they can to befriend them.

FIELD: This as, officials say, she had been sneaking both men certain supplies like glasses with lights on them, beginning over a year and a half ago. She claims she had no idea back then that the tools were going to be used to help them dig out of the maximum security prison.

WYLIE: She was told by Matt they were using those to stay up late at night to paint pictures or to read.

FIELD: Sources also say the escapees planned to kill Mitchell's husband. And that she was aware, but it's unclear if she knew the exact details.

Investigators say the possible murder of her husband Lyle was one of the reasons she got cold feet and back out as being their getaway driver. But officials say they can't imagine Matt and Sweat would go through something so elaborate and so meticulous to rely on one person to get them out of town, and that they may have always had a better plan.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

So, Carol, even without any fresh signs indicating that these fugitives are still in this area, the search effort is still heavily concentrated here. We're talking about hundreds and hundreds of law enforcement officers who are on the ground, tracking down hundreds and hundreds of tips coming from virtually every direction. But they have again kept a lot of their search areas on this sort of three square mile area, not from the prison.

You can see even a roadblock behind me. We're told this roadblock will stay in place at least through today. Every car coming in and out is still being searched.

COSTELLO: All right. Alexandra Field, reporting live from West Plattsburg, New York, this morning.

So, hacksaw blades, chisels and drill bits, that's the hardware the two murders used to escape their New York prison. But their greatest tool may be even more sinister, the art of manipulation, both of the system and allegedly, the prison employee, Joyce Mitchell.

My next guest saw the con game being played from the inside. Patrick Johnson spent 30 years at the Chautauqua County Jail, the last eight serving as warden. He joins us from Buffalo.

Welcome, sir. PATRICK JOHNSON, FORMER WARDEN, CHAUTAUQUA COUNTY JAIL: Good morning. How are you doing?

COSTELLO: I'm good.

First of all, where do you think these two escaped killers are?

JOHNSON: I really don't know. The state police and the federal agencies that are conducting the search and the intelligence reports would have a better idea. And it seems like now that they really don't have a clue where these two gentlemen are. So, you know, for me being an outsider, not having any of the information to form any own opinion, I really don't know where they could be.

I think Governor Cuomo is correct, they could be as far as Mexico, or they could just be two miles away. They're just not having a lot of luck finding these two.

COSTELLO: All right. Back to the investigation, I want to talk a little bit about Joyce Mitchell. She said that the plan fell apart and she didn't pick up these guys and provide them with a getaway car because they planned to kill her husband. So, these two guys were in prison. Is it possible they could have carried out a hit on her husband?

JOHNSON: Well, she was supposed to meet them after they escaped. These are two very dangerous men. And they could have easily taken her back to her home and done what they said they were going to do and kill her husband.

I also think that if she would have given them a ride to that seven- hour mark, wherever that is in the country, that she wouldn't be alive today either.

COSTELLO: A lot of people think exactly that way.

If Joyce Mitchell was your employee right now, how old you characterize her?

JOHNSON: Well, she's a weak individual with her personality. She let two inmates get the better of her, play on her emotions. She was easily manipulated by them just by making her feel good about herself. That's not uncommon.

Inmates do play these games with staff. They target people. You know, first thing they do is they observe every employee that works in a facility. And we're all susceptible to some type of manipulation.

So, what they do is constantly watching us. And we're charged with supervising the inmates and watching them. And through the most part, correction officers and staffer with inmates eight hours a day, the inmates are watching us 24 hours a day. Even when lights are out, some inmates are aware awake and they observe what type of behavior we're putting out there for them to observe.

And they look for people who maybe are weak personalities, don't have confidence. And then they start testing them, they start nudging them, to see if they're going to, you know, break, or commit small rule violations. And if they see that, and they will try to get the officers or the staff to commit further violations, just to see how far they can manipulate them.