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CNN NEWSROOM

Heroin's Deadly Comeback; Debating Stand Your Ground; Controversial 'Rolling Stone' Cover

Aired July 17, 2013 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: She is being remembered as an adorable pint sized advocate who won the hearts of so many. Thalia Joy Casiano has died in Orlando, Florida, six years after being diagnosed with cancer. She was named an honorary cover girl after gaining Internet fame by offering makeup tips for kids with cancer on YouTube. I want you to listen to how she dealt with going bald after her chemotherapy treatments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THALIA JOY CASIANO: Now going in public I feel proud. And I really feel that I can show my head. I mean, my head's beautiful. Please. If I had hair, I'd flip it, but, yes. I mean, I still love dancing around in wigs. I mean, I don't wear wigs in public anymore. I just feel fake, I don't know.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Talia spent the past six months in the hospital after the cancer spread to her bones. Talia Joy Castellano was 13 years young.

And here we go, top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Let's get to it. Florida's controversial stand your ground law is being scrutinized, of course, in the wake of the George Zimmerman verdict. Right now there are demonstrators both young and old protesting inside Florida's Capitol. Look at them. What do they want? They want to repeal the stand your ground law, which allows a person to use deadly force if he or she feels great danger with no obligation to retreat.

In fact, we just learned today that Stevie Wonder says he is boycotting the entire state of Florida, won't play a gig down there until stand your ground is repealed.

Also, the National Rifle Association is slamming U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder for his comments that he made in Orlando just yesterday condemning the stand your ground laws. The NRA says Holder is using the Zimmerman case for political gain.

Quick reminder to all of us, though. Zimmerman's legal team did not invoke stand your ground as part of his defense. Florida's stand your ground law though did impact the judge's instructions to the jury as we learned in that juror B-37 interview with Anderson Cooper.

Want to take you straight to the Capitol floor to Victor Blackwell standing by for us in Tallahassee.

Victor, you have talked to some of these folks who are demonstrating there at the state Capitol. What are they telling you?

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: In addition to the repeal of the stand your ground law, they also want the state to ban zero tolerance policies in school districts across the state and they want to have an honest conversation about racial profiling.

One thing you mentioned is that the stand your ground law was not used as an argument to defend George Zimmerman, but the leader of this group, Dream Defenders, which is holding the sit-in in Governor Rick Scott's office, says that although they know that, they do not want in their words another vigilante to be able to use the law to defend him or herself against killing another unarmed person.

There are about 30 of them who are sitting in his office. Yesterday at 10:00 Eastern they walked in, demanded to see the governor. They have not left. They did the same thing again today. They say they will do so until they get a meeting with Governor Scott.

BALDWIN: Speaking of the governor, we know he assembled this panel. This was after Trayvon Martin was shot and killed last February. He got a bunch of folks together to take a good, long look at stand your ground. What did they come up with?

BLACKWELL: They came up with the simple recommendation they should not change this law, it should not be overturned. But there were several questions about who are the people who are coming up with this recommendation? Of the 19, the people who were legislative officers who were either in the state Senate or Statehouse were people who supported this law or voted for it in the view of the people who are sitting in his office right now.

And the people who likely would have some objection to it were not people who had a vote in the Statehouse or the state Senate. So the people who are waiting to speak with the governor say that that panel was rigged from the start, from the moment it was created.

BALDWIN: Victor Blackwell for us in Tallahassee. Victor, appreciate it.

I want to talk more about the stand your ground. It was certainly a hot topic last night during a town hall that Anderson Cooper hosted on CNN called "Race and Justice in America."

Here's a portion of that conversation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Charles, when you say that the system failed Trayvon Martin long before that shot was fired, what do you mean?

CHARLES BLOW, COLUMNIST, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Well, I think that you have to look at all of the contributing factors here, including Florida's self-defense laws, which allow someone to be an aggressor, if you assume that George Zimmerman was an aggressor when he got out of his car.

They allow you to be the aggressor. And if you engage in a fight and you start to lose that fight, the idea of self-defense can switch personage. You had it first when I was following you and I engaged you. The moment that I start to lose, it bounces from you to me.

COOPER: And in my interview with the juror, she said, that's all -- that's what they looked at, what happened in those final minutes in that fight. He feared for his life, so he was...

(CROSSTALK)

BLOW: And that's a moral question. Like, how is it possible that you could even write a law where you have no culpability? I'm not saying that if you feel like your life is about to be taken that you shouldn't do everything to preserve it. That's just a human thing. But you should have some culpability for starting this action and getting it rolling. And there's none.

SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: These stand your ground laws in a sense take our humanity away, our civility away. Yes, if you're in your home and someone breaks in, you have every right to stand your ground and protect your home, protect your family.

But if you're out in the street, an altercation happens, you mean to tell me you then don't have any civility to try to retreat and to try to say, wait, wait, wait, let me get away, let's try to work this out? That's what stand your ground does. It allows you to kill.

(CROSSTALK)

HOSTIN: And we have got to look at that.

BENJAMIN CRUMP, ATTORNEY FOR FAMILY OF TRAYVON MARTIN: It sends an irresponsible message in this true sense that your stand your ground claim goes up exponentially as long as you make sure the person is dead.

COOPER: I want to bring in Mark Geragos, who is in the audience.

As we heard earlier, the federal government looked into this. Black males are sentenced by federal court almost 20 percent longer than white males who had similar convictions.

MARK GERAGOS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Right. And that's -- it's not just federal court.

It is state courts, it is every day in court. It is what happens. It starts not when you get to court, it starts when you get arrested. Where are, who are the people who are being profiled by police? Who are the people being pulled over by police? Race infects everything in the criminal justice system.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BALDWIN: Now this. An alleged killer as a cover boy? What I'm about to show you is the object of condemnation that calls for a boycott today. Look at this. This is the August 3 issue of "Rolling Stone" magazine. And you see his face front and center. This is Boston Marathon bombing suspect Dzhokhar Tsarnaev smack dab on the cover.

And you can imagine it's drawing all kinds of backlash. We have now learned today that CVS pharmacies and Tedeschi Food Shops are refusing to sell this. Some of the words being used to describe it. You hear tasteless. And another we read today, sickening, also the word disgusting. Words being thrown about in social media just to describe this "Rolling Stone" cover.

On the "Rolling Stone" Web site, let me get this in. They have now responded with this statement. Quote: "Our hearts go out to the victims of the Boston Marathon bombing and our thoughts are always with them and their families. The cover story we are publishing this week falls within the traditions of journalism and "Rolling Stone"'s longstanding commitment to serious and thoughtful coverage of the most important political and cultural issues of our day."

It goes on. "The fact that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is young and in the same age group as many of our readers makes it all the more important for us to examine the complexities of this issue and gain a more complete understanding of how a tragedy like this happens."

Listen, if you're a reader of "Rolling Stone" you know they're no stranger to controversy. We went back through. And we want to show just some of the past covers that roiled some people. You had cult leader, mass killer Charles Manson graced the cover. Also back in 1972, sans clothing, teen idol David Cassidy, remember, naked?

Also, John Lennon and Yoko Ono in a portrait taken hours before Lennon was assassinated. And Britney Spears provocatively posing, she was all of 17 years of age. Lady Gaga showing off a pair of guns. And the cast of this vampire series on HBO "True Blood" covered in blood.

A lot of people talked about those through the years. This isn't new. But the cover featuring the alleged Boston bomber could have a much more significant impact than any of those covers of years past. Take a look at this tweet. This is from former White House National Security Council spokesman Tommy Vietor -- quote -- "Isn't black and white. A disaffected U.S. kid could see this and think terrorists are afforded rock star status."

That tweet was addressed to my colleague Jake Tapper, host of "THE LEAD."

And, Jake Tapper, isn't Tommy Vietor from -- he is from Boston?

JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: He is a Boston boy.

In fact, he's going to be going there tomorrow and so this is an issue for him that has some personal resonance, although he says Boston is way too strong to ever let anything like a magazine cover distract it. But I have to say, Tommy and I have been talking on the phone about this. He will come on "THE LEAD" at the top of the hour to talk about this issue.

He feels very passionately about this having worked in the national security staff about what he sees as what is an important part of combating terrorism which is to send a message to young, disaffected individuals who might pursue a path of terrorism that there is nothing good down that way, that that path leads to your death, your family being devastated, and you -- basically your memory being obliterated.

He says this "Rolling Stone" cover basically offers to people, offers to young disaffected people a chance at immortality. And the picture of Dzhokhar Tsarnaev as you see is a rock star-esque photograph. Obviously, there are people who feel passionately on the other side of the issue. But that's Tommy's view. He will be talking to us later today about it.

BALDWIN: Yes, I have seen visual comparisons today -- talk about rock star status -- the curly face, the face -- to Jim Morrison on the cover of "Rolling Stone."

I will be interested to see what Tommy Vietor has to say to you, Mr. Tapper. We will be looking for you top of the hour for "THE LEAD" coming up.

Coming up next, we will stay on this topic. We will talk to a Boston firefighter, someone I interviewed when I was covering the marathon bombings, the aftermath, a man by the name of Ed Kelly. He is joining me today. His reaction right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: We just talked about the cover of the upcoming issue of "Rolling Stone," the one with the younger Tsarnaev brother, the Boston bombing suspect, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, on the cover. The backlash has been swift. We have now learned today these two different store chains of CVS pharmacies and Tedeschi, they're refusing to stock this particular issue of the magazine in stores and their pharmacies.

Right now I want to bring in Ed Kelly. He is a Boston firefighter. He's the president of the Professional Firefighters of Massachusetts. We chatted back in April.

Ed, good to see you. Thank you for coming on.

ED KELLY, PRESIDENT, PROFESSIONAL FIREFIGHTERS OF MASSACHUSETTS: Thanks for having me, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Tell me, you saw the picture of this younger Tsarnaev. What was your first thought?

KELLY: I was disturbed.

You know, really, the picture that they chose -- one, to put him on the cover of "Rolling Stone" magazine was insulting as it is. It does give the depiction to the youth of America that that is something to aspire to, which definitely obviously sends the wrong message. But the actual picture that they chose really portrays the innocence of youth.

He gave up any innocence he had on April 15, when he took the life of an innocent child, two women, and then went on to execute a police officer.

BALDWIN: You know, I have read many a "Rolling Stone" magazine. They have incredible journalists. They say this is good journalism. They talked to all kinds of people to put this whole very thorough story together on Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.

Is there a different picture? Would a different picture of Dzhokhar Tsarnaev been OK to you as a Bostonian?

KELLY: It certainly would not.

If they used his booking picture or the picture of when he was being arrested and really portrayed it for why he is -- why they chose to do a story, why "Rolling Stone" chose to do a story on him, it was because he murdered people, because he's a terrorist. And they didn't depict him that on the front of their magazine.

And a picture speaks 1,000 words. What he did to our city, our country, we're never going to forgive him for it. We're not going to cower from it. But it disturbs us that our media chooses to celebrate it.

BALDWIN: Well, we're not celebrating it. We're telling the story. And we wanted -- again, I wanted to go straight to you and get the perspective.

Just to remind our viewers, you were five blocks in the fire station, five blocks from the finish line when those two bombs went off. Your wife ran the marathon and had just finished. Have you talked to your wife? Have you talked to other firefighters? Have they seen the cover of this magazine? Is your thought unique to just you or is this what everyone you have talked to is thinking?

KELLY: Everyone I have talked to in Boston feels the same way. It's an inappropriate picture of a murderer, a murderer, a terrorist, someone who killed an innocent child, maimed and wounded hundreds, and really everything that tries to subvert what is great about this country, the ability to pursue freedom and happiness and liberty. And that's really what their target was that day.

And I say shame on "Rolling Stone" magazine for choosing a picture of him which portrays him as an innocent youth, when, in fact, his innocence is gone. He hasn't had his day in court yet. But he's a self-admitted murderer. And, you know, from my perspective, I know my executive board at the Professional Firefighters of Massachusetts have taken a vote to support the boycott of "Rolling Stone" magazine, "Men's Journal" and "U.S. Weekly" that are all tied into the same media group.

BALDWIN: Ed Kelly, Boston firefighter, friend of mine. Ed, thank you. Appreciate it.

(CROSSTALK)

KELLY: God bless America.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Coming up next, this woman now responding to criticism from her fellow jurors in the George Zimmerman trial. And she is addressing reports of a book deal. Stay with me.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Jurors in George Zimmerman's trial were united in their verdict. But they now want to stand sort of divided in the aftermath here.

Four of the six jurors have issued a statement saying the opinions of juror B-37 expressed in an exclusive CNN interview are just that, her opinions, not representative of the others. Meanwhile, that juror, B- 37, has released a statement about her one-on-one with Anderson Cooper.

Let me read this for you.

"Thank you for the opportunity to vent some of the anguish which has been in me since the trial began. For reasons of my own, I needed to speak alone. My prayers are with all those who have the influence and power to modify the laws that left me with no verdict option other than not guilty in order to remain within the instructions. No other family should be forced to endure what the Martin family has endured."

We should also point out because a lot of you have been asking about this whole book thing, so she is also saying now she will not be writing a book at this time. Sympathy was also expressed by the four other jurors. So this is a portion of the statement they released yesterday.

Let me quote them: "The death of a teenager weighed heavily on our hearts, but in the end we did what the law required us to do. We appeal to the highest standards of your profession and ask the media to respect privacy and give us time to process what we have been through. Thank you, Juror B-51, Juror B-76, Juror E-6, Juror E-40."

Coming up next, if you have filled up lately, you have seen that gas prices are going up. How high? Hear why it's five bucks a gallon in some places. Ugh.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: It goes up. It goes down. It is costing you now more to fill up. Gas prices are skyrocketing, up 18 cents a gallon just this last week, the national average for regular unleaded $3.66 a gallon.

But check this out, five bucks a gallon at some stations in Los Angeles. Sorry for those in L.A. Egypt's uprising is actually what's helping push up the oil prices. Crude oil supplies are down as refineries stop for maintenance. Also skyrocketing profits at Bank of America.

Alison Kosik at the New York Stock Exchange with that.

Alison Kosik, give us the numbers.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Brooke. Yes, these are big numbers.

Bank of America reporting that its profits jumped more than 60 percent in the latest quarter, earning about $4 billion. It was helped by a strong environment for Wall Street deals. We are seeing shares of Bank of America right now up about 3 percent. It is one of the biggest gainers on the Dow, which isn't moving too much. But Bank of America is moving pretty well.

BALDWIN: Alison, thank you.

Coming up next, amid the news of a "Glee" star's death, our special report, a half-hour we're dedicating, calling it "Heroin's Deadly Comeback." We will talk with a recovering addict, actually two, a counselor for celebrity rehab, many, many other voices here about the alarming rise of heroin use across America.

Please don't miss this.

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