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Deadly Raid Has Bomb Suspect Ties; Terror, Faith And Stereotypes; Fight On Mt. Everest; Timing Of Tsarnaev Hearing Under Fire
Aired April 29, 2013 - 14:29 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Nick, explain the connection to this dead suspect, what we saw in the video, this deadly raid in Dagestan, and possibly also a separate raid at a mosque in Moscow.
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, what we're looking at there are pictures of the very early morning raid yesterday, Sunday morning, which killed a militant known as Shakladen Ahharbaov (ph). Now, he was part of a militant group headed by a man called Abu Dujan, who was killed back in December also by Russian special forces.
How does all that relate to the Boston bombings? Well, there was a video of Abu Dujan linked to Tamerlan's Tsarnaev YouTube Channel. Now we don't know if those two guys ever met, but that link is certainly there.
The man killed in that raid you just saw was part of the group. In fact, the brother of the successor -- the leader of the group, when Abu Dujan died, so there is clearly something happening on the ground in Russia, chasing down members of Abu Dujan's group.
We just don't know if that is specifically because any of them met Tamerlan Tsarnaev, but it is an interesting coincidence that that raid happened. The FBI and FSB continue to exchange information -- Brooke.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Nick, it's Jake Tapper here in Boston. Do we know if the U.S. specifically had anything to do with this raid? And bigger picture, you talk about how the U.S. is working with Russian intelligence, the FSB and other groups. How much closer has this cooperation become since the bombings, and since it became clear that there was a Russian connection to all of this?
WALSH: Well, we have absolutely no idea if the U.S. had anything to do with the raid we saw this morning. It could be a pure coincidence that Abu Dujan's group is being taken out now as we speak.
Of course, these raids happen frequently in that part of the world, militants often being chased down by a very aggressive Russian security services. Has cooperation expanded? Well, we have interestingly today heard kind of the first comments really from the Russian government since President Putin talked in his press conference last week about how they not have been able to get anything of operational significance. An aid to the president saying that cooperation between American and Russian special services over this has reached a high level, continues to be as best as they possibly can in relation to the Boston bombing and another suggestion too quoted by state news agency, the spokesman for that Vladimir Putin saying, look, we're doing what we can.
Unfortunately we haven't been able to help so much because these guys weren't actually spending much of their life inside Russia. A slight equivocation there, part of this suggesting a lot of cooperation, and other parts trying to play down what they might be able to do to help.
So clearly there is information being passed over, and because of that, Russian apparently official reports suggesting that the mother of Tsarnaev is being attached in one of the sounds quite discussing Jihad. That information was only passed over in the past few days so definitely a cooperation ongoing -- Jake.
BALDWIN: OK, Nick Paton Walsh, thank you so much.
TAPPER: Attacks like the Boston bombings and the evidence pointing to suspects who appear to be radicalized Muslims always raise concerns about religious stereotyping, of course. We wanted to bring back our guests from Friday, two imams from here in the Boston area, Imam Webb and Imam Talal. Thank you so much for joining us.
Are you worried about stereotyping? Obviously, there is -- I don't want to be crass about it, but there is a reason that stereotyping happens. A lot of the incidents of terrorism, successful or otherwise, have been radicalized Muslims.
Obviously, it's a vast minority of the Muslim people, but it is an unfortunate reality that current terrorists are Islamic terrorists in a lot of ways. How -- first of all, what do you do to make sure that people like that, in your community, if you ever come across any of them, are the authorities find out about them?
IMAM TALAL EID, ISLAMIC INSTITUTE OF BOSTON: Thanks for hosting us. Let me -- this is not something new for me. I've been here for 30 years in the United States and every time it rains on us as I always say. The issue of terrorists and linking it to Islam is something -- I have a problem with it.
You know, the shooter in Newtown, I mean, nobody raised the issue of which church he would go and this, and also labelling us as responsible. It would bring less confidence to us and to our children. I was going back --
TAPPER: I never labeled you as responsible. I mean, I want to make sure you --
EID: I was coming back from a trip to two countries, sponsored by the State Department, and when I landed in Logan, they looked at the passport, Chad, Afghanistan, and I was humiliated by that. So this idea of pinpointing at our children is something I disagree with because it is not going to bring any benefit to the issue.
BALDWIN: Let me jump in, because there is a question, let me just -- this is from Thomas Friedman, op-ed Thomas Friedman "New York Times. Let me just read this quote for you and I just want to react to this when it comes to the Muslim community here.
So this is what Mr. Friedman writes. What is going on in your community that a critical number of youthful leads every American military action in the Middle East justifies a violent response --
TAPPER: The question is what is going on?
IMAM SUHAIB WEBB, BOSTON ISLAMIC CULTURAL CENTER: My ministry touches around 200,000 youth across the world and I have never come across a youth that has those kinds of radical views.
BALDWIN: You never have?
WEBB: Never. And what we're seeing as far as Americans and addressing some of your concerns is people say how come Muslim leadership hasn't denounced terrorism because I might differ with my respected guest. I think there is a problem in the Muslim community with radicalization.
I don't think it is the American-Muslim community, I think it is outside. Last week in Canada, an imam is the one who turned authorities on to the potential, you know, destruction of a train. Responding to Peter King's assertion that the American Muslim community is responsible, he said, I have no idea who he is getting his information from.
So how we responded to that as locally as clergy to treat it like gang violence, to look after the youth who may have those tendency to sit down with them and have an intervention session that goes over some of the texts, ideas they might have and what I've come across, very similar to the bomber.
It is coming from overseas, "Inspire" magazine, which I read and was blown away by, and so our job here is to work with the FBI. We have a great relationship. In fact, some communities meet with them weekly or even monthly here in Boston to address that problem that exists. It does exist.
BALDWIN: Apparently, the elder Tsarnaev, Tamerlan, was disruptive in a couple of different occasions in this particular mosque in Cambridge.
TAPPER: The Islamic center of Boston.
WEBB: And Muslim institutions on the front line of that intervention process. And if we are made to feel guilty, that hurts our efforts also to intervene.
BALDWIN: But at the same time, it is interesting how you parallel this to maybe you said, like a gang --
WEBB: Gang violence and delinquency, yes.
BALDWIN: Gang violence and delinquency. So your eyes are wide open. Are your eyes wide open to this potentially? I mean, Imam Webb said he never had to see -- or never noticed any sort of delinquent behavior. Have you noticed anything, any younger Muslim?
EID: Well, this is where I was coming to in my talk and in the beginning. I'm saying that linking it too much to Islam and Muslims is -- it is -- it can hurt us, but this job, the issue of radicalism is also the job of Islamic centres to handle it. It is not to keep silent about it.
That's why, like, Friday, I was saying that about the barrier. My concerns, not the one who died, my concern is the one who is coming next and those they should get clear message. So the community needs to work with law enforcement agents.
We work together to combat terrorists rather than blaming Islam and putting surveillance and watching us whenever we go. This is the point that I like to emphasize.
TAPPER: And, in fact, law enforcement say stereotyping is obviously just empirically wrong and also, even if you don't buy the ideals, it is stupid because you don't want to alienate a community that can be the best friend of the rest of the community when it comes to sorting --
WEBB: Even to the discourse of the radicals that America is innately anti- -- I'm from Oklahoma, I'm as American as you can get and I love the Celtics, by the way. But Sheriff Baca actually called up Peter King and said I have no idea where you're getting your information from.
The Muslim community, they have consistently since 2001 walked hand in hand with law enforcement to try to repel this potential problem. There is a problem in certain theological centres in the Muslim world that pushes that ideology, it is our job as local imams and scholars and law enforcement to repel that.
BALDWIN: Just in the wake of what happened in Boston, the wake of some of the questions that were brought up over the weekend in some of these shows. We just wanted to get answers from the community here in Boston. We appreciate it so much. Thanks for coming back. Thank you so much for coming back.
TAPPER: Imam Talal, Imam Webb, thank you so much.
BALDWIN: OK, coming up here in Boston, a brawl.
TAPPER: A brawl on Mt. Everest. Believe it or not, European climbers fought with their guides. Now police are investigating more on this four-mile high melee after this break.
BALDWIN: Want to tell you about this bizarre situation on Mt. Everest, happened over this past weekend, this fight, broke out between three foreign climbers and a group of Sherpas. Sherpas, local guides, gets you up the mountain. Chad Myers joins us from Atlanta. Chad, what happened?
CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: You know, usually we talk about brawls on ice, something to do with hockey. Not up at 24,500 feet. Three climbers, one Brit national, one Swiss national and an Italian were up on the mountain wanting to go farther.
The Sherpa said, wait, we have to put lines down. These guys were professionals. They've been on top of the mountain a number of times. They just went and when they went up, they actually kicked some ice back down on the Sherpas. Well, that got the Sherpas very angry as you can imagine.
They're up here 24,500 feet and they're walking up this very steep incline from base camp, right there, base camp three. As it came down, the ice hit one of the Sherpas. So a number of them, like up to 40, went up there and literally had a fight with these three guys and said, you have one hour as we understand, he said, you have one hour to get off this mountain and you'll be OK.
Otherwise, you won't be. So the police are investigating. Right now, it is a he said/he said kind of thing. We'll have to see how this shakes out, but a brawl at 24,500 feet. Maybe they were just deprived of oxygen.
BALDWIN: Maybe so. I just know that the farthest I've gotten up Mt. Everest is reading about it. You don't mess with the Sherpas. They know what they're doing.
TAPPER: Don't mess with lamas either.
BALDWIN: Chad, thank you.
MYERS: You're welcome.
TAPPER: Congressman Peter King calls the decision to read Dzhokhar Tsarnaev his Miranda Rights during an interrogation, quote, "disgraceful." The congressman says it was not required by American law. Some people however, say, he should have been read the rights as soon as he was captured. Who's right? That's next.
BALDWIN: Since being read his rights, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has been less forth coming to investigators. Now critics have become increasingly vocal about the timing of when Tsarnaev heard this, quote, "You have the right under the constitution of the United States to remain silent, any statement made by you may be used against you in court and you have the right not to have your own words used against you."
You've heard this. This is a quote from U.S. Magistrate Mary Ann Voler to Tsarnaev during a bedside hearing one week ago today, when investigators had only questioned Tsarnaev for 16 hours prior to being Mirandized.
Now several lawmakers say Tsarnaev heard his Miranda Rights too soon and important intelligence information may now be out of reach because of that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. PETER KING (R), NEW YORK: I don't know of any case law, which says the magistrate has the right to come into a hospital room and stop an interrogation. I don't know why the attorney general of the United States consented to that. The FBI wanted to continue the interrogation.
And Eric Holder now is -- said he approved that interrogation being stopped. It is absolutely disgraceful because that interrogation could have ended up saving many of American lives. We don't know the full consequences are going to be, who else is involved, who was involved then, who could be involved in the future. We may not know because of Eric Holder.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Talk about the timing of this younger Tsarnaev getting his Miranda Rights read. Let's bring in CNN's legal analyst Sunny Hostin. Sunny, you were a federal prosecutor. So who makes the call, when to read a person his or her Miranda Rights? Is it normally the judge and after how long?
SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: You know, I was a federal prosecutor, Brooke. This is what has been frustrating me about this particular story. The federal rules of criminal procedure mandate the timing in this case. No judge will respond on her own and decide to interrupt an interrogation.
That is not what happened here. What happened is that April 21st, 2013, at about 6:47 p.m., a complaint was filed against this defendant, and what the federal rules provide, Brooke, is that once that complaint is filed, an initial appearance must be had without unnecessary delay.
And that is exactly what happened, this first appearance, wherein you must always read someone his -- a defendant's rights happened according to procedure. And, remember, it happened with the cooperation of not only the prosecutor, but of the Federal Public Defender's Office with this defendant's lawyers.
And so the suggestion that these politicians are making that somehow this judge did this just on her own, for me, is just so ludicrous. It's so unfair and it is just a misstatement when it comes to the law.
TAPPER: Sunny, the attorney general said investigators got good leads. How could that be if the suspect was so heavily sedated at the time with the multiple wounds on his leg and his throat?
HOSTIN: Well, you know, I certainly wasn't there during the interrogations, Jake. And I'm not certain that he was sedated and was unable to, you know, cooperate with investigators. Some people are reporting that he was questioned for about 16 hours. And that he did give information.
And, remember, other than Miranda law or Miranda Rights, rather, you have a certain amount of time to question, while it is not fixed amount of time, it has to be for the public safety. That's what the exception is about.
So once the questions are gone over and that information is gathered, the process moves on and that's what happened here. To suggest anything else, to suggest that somehow, you know, the law wasn't followed, really, really is a misinterpretation of the law and what happened here.
BALDWIN: OK, Sunny Hostin, former federal prosecutor, thank you so much, Sunny, for your perspective. We appreciate it.
Coming up here in Boston, it's the story of small town rivalry and Elvis impersonator and a taekwondo instructor and ricin. A man charged with mailing toxic letters to President Obama appears in court for the very first time today. We'll find out what happened inside the courtroom next.
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TAPPER: Welcome back to CNN's continuing coverage of the terrorists' attacks here and other news, of course, a federal judge in Mississippi has set the next hearing date for James Everett Dutschke.
He is the man arrested over the weekend for allegedly mailing envelopes containing the deadly poison ricin to President Obama and two others including Senator Wicker Of Mississippi. The previous suspect, Paul Kevin Curtis, the Elvis impersonator, he helped lead officials to Dutschke. Curtis initially arrested and charged has now been cleared. CNN's Alina Machado is with us now live from Oxford, Mississippi. Alina, how long did today's hearing last and what have we learned? Not hearing anything on our --
BALDWIN: All right, we can't hear her. We'll work on getting her back up so she can give us the insight as far as what happened inside that courtroom today.
Meantime, back here in Boston, the mysterious "Misha" is finally revealed. Brian Todd, for what the better part of the last week -- knocking doors, tracked down the parents of this man who apparently inspired the older suspect Tamerlas Tsarnaev in the Boston marathon bombings two weeks ago. Those new details are next.
BALDWIN: Welcome back to CNN, top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me. We're live in Boston today for special coverage of the investigation into the Boston marathon bombing. We have a lot of news to get to on this Monday afternoon.
First, the search for answers today is turning to the home of Tamerlan Tsarnaev's widow Katie Russell. The FBI spending just about 90 minutes inside her family's home in Rhode Island. These are new pictures we have got thanks to our crew there.
Erin McPike is our correspondent outside that house today. And, Erin, tell me that kind of activity you've seen today what you're seeing right now.
ERIN MCPIKE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, as you mentioned, they were inside Katie Russell's parents' house here behind for about 90 minutes. Now when they came out, we saw about five of these FBI investigators leave, several of them were carrying black equipment cases. One of them had a clear plastic bag with several items in it. I saw some scissors and that bag was marked DNA samples.