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Coroner Performs Preliminary Autopsy on Kanye West`s Mother; Ben Affleck`s Transformation
Aired November 13, 2007 - 23:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
A.J. HAMMER, CO-HOST: I`ve got the stunning transformation of Ben Affleck from rehab to Oscar winner to daddy. I`m A.J. Hammer in New York.
BROOKE ANDERSON, CO-HOST: And I`m investigating an explosive Hollywood weight shocker. Are curvy stars scientifically smarter than skinny ones? I`m Brooke Anderson in Hollywood. TV`s most provocative show starts right now.
HAMMER: On SHOWBIZ TONIGHT, shocking new details about the tragic death of rap superstar Kanye West`s mom. Tonight, startling questions about the TV doctor who performed the plastic surgery.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALICIA QUARLES, CORRESPONDENT, THE ASSOCIATED PRESS: The doctor seemed a little bit sketchy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: Plus, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT uncovers the dangers of celebrity plastic surgery and the controversial message stars send about body image. Tonight, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT investigates the sad and stunning death of Kanye`s mom.
Lindsay Lohan outrage. Tonight, Lindsay begins serving time for her, not one, but two DUIs. But she is not behind bars. She`s at a blood bank, and that`s got a lot of people`s blood boiling. Tonight, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT asks the controversial question, did Lindsay get off too easy?
HAMMER: Hello. I`m A.J. Hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from New York City.
ANDERSON: Hi there, everyone, I`m Brooke Anderson coming to you from Hollywood. Tonight Lindsay Lohan isn`t serving her jail time for her two DUIs. She`s working at a blood bank and that has some asked for blood saying that she is getting off scot-free. We`re going to have the outrage coming up.
HAMMER: But first, tonight, the mystery surrounding the death of Kanye West`s mother continues. The SHOWBIZ TONIGHT staff has been chasing down the details of this sad, sad story all day long. And just hours ago, the coroner performed a preliminary autopsy on the superstar`s mother.
What`s new right now? They say they don`t have a definitive answer on exactly what killed her. Also tonight, there are even more questions about this well-known surgeon who you may have seen on "Oprah" who performed the cosmetic surgery that preceded her death. There are questions about the competency of this surgeon. SHOWBIZ TONIGHT can tell you this is turning into a true Hollywood medical mystery.
HAMMER: The death of Kanye West`s mother, Donda West, is a sad, tragic story of a superstar who lost his best friend, his manager, and a living inspiration he often sang about.
KANYE WEST, MUSIC SUPERSTAR (singing): I want to sing so loud for you because I`m so proud of you.
QUARLES: His mother is his inspiration. She`s his best friend. She`s his confidant, his everything. Kanye has got to be devastated.
ELLEN DEGENERES, HOST, "THE ELLEN DEGENERES SHOW": Just a wonderful, vibrant woman.
HAMMER: Ellen DeGeneres paid tribute to Donda West on Wednesday`s edition of her talk show. But SHOWBIZ TONIGHT can tell you Donda West`s tragic death reportedly after she got cosmetic surgery is turning into a full- blown Hollywood mystery.
QUARLES: There`s definitely a mystery around her death. Nobody really knows what`s going on.
HAMMER: And now, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT brings you some of the answers about how and when Donda West died and about the celebrity plastic surgeon who now finds himself under fire.
HARVEY LEVIN, MANAGING EDITOR, "TMZ.COM": He`s a pretty high-profile guy and it`s interesting that nobody seemed to do any investigating on his past.
HAMMER: This tragedy has everyone talking about the possible dangers of cosmetic surgery.
QUARLES: We`ve got "Dr. 90210," We have "Nip/Tuck." We never think that this is very serious. Nobody ever thinks that you`re going to die as a result of complications from cosmetic surgery.
HAMMER: Donda West was the guiding light behind Kanye West`s success. She quit her job as a college professor to manage her son`s exploding career. She was only 58 years old when she died. CNN`s Lola Ogunnaike, who`s interviewed Kanye West on several occasions says she ran into Kanye`s mother just last September at the MTV Video Music Awards.
LOLA OGUNNAIKE, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: She appeared to be in perfect health, not a problem in sight.
HAMMER: But even though Donda West appeared healthy, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT can tell you she reportedly had trouble convincing surgeons that she was healthy enough for a tummy tuck and breast reduction surgery.
LEVIN: A Beverly Hills doctor saw Donda West about two months ago and he told her she had a medical condition. And he wouldn`t perform the surgery until she got a note from her internist. She never got the note.
HAMMER: Donda West then reportedly turned to Dr. Jan Adams, a fixture on Discovery Health Channel and a past guest on "Oprah."
DR. JAN ADAMS, PLASTIC SURGEON: What you really want to do is pull from the hairline so you hide the incisions.
OPRAH WINFREY, HOST, "THE OPRAH WINFREY SHOW": Oh, never mind that.
LEVIN: You`ve got this kind of quasi-celebrity doctor who has been all over TV.
HAMMER: Harvey Levin of "TMZ.com" tells SHOWBIZ TONIGHT Dr. Adams is coming forward saying he performed the breast reduction and tummy tuck surgery on Donda West.
LEVIN: He performed the surgery on Friday morning. It lasted eight hours. I`m told that`s twice as long as it should have lasted. Dr. Adams, did not - did not - send her to a recovery center. So he just sent her home and she died a day later. But he says he did nothing wrong.
But now SHOWBIZ TONIGHT can tell you Dr. Adams has some disturbing things in his past, including two malpractice judgments against him in 2001. And there`s more.
LEVIN: The medical board`s executive director is trying to either suspend or revoke his license.
HAMMER: SHOWBIZ TONIGHT has obtained these documents filed just last April by the California State Medical Board citing Dr. Adams` two DUI arrests. The papers say Dr. Adams, quote, "has used alcohol to the extent or in such a manner as to be dangerous or injurious to himself and others."
But it must be pointed out nobody is outright blaming Dr. Adams for Donda West`s death, and no one is saying cosmetic surgery is unsafe. Figures say only one surgery in more than 50,000 results in death. But tonight, the risks are on everyone`s mind.
QUARLES: I think the death of Donda West is making us all wake up. Her death shows that it is surgery and we all need to take it seriously and really think about it before we go under the knife.
HAMMER: And it`s a lesson that comes from one grieving superstar`s personal loss.
HAMMER: Well, without a doubt, this is Hollywood`s biggest mystery tonight. Joining me tonight from Hollywood, investigative journalist Pat Lalama and Beverly Hills plastic surgeon Dr. Jon Perlman who you may have seen on ABC`s "Extreme Makeover." I appreciate you being here.
Pat, I want to start with you because I know that you know this guy. You`re out there in the Beverly Hills area. He is such a high-profile Beverly Hills plastic surgeon. He`s got all the star clients. So, really, Pat, it`s not surprising at all that a high-profile person like Donda West would seek out Dr. Adams for the work she wanted to have done, right?
PAT LALAMA, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST: Well, A.J., for the record, he`s not my plastic surgeon, so let`s get that straight. We both attended the Ohio State University and we have that connection. I see him around town and he`d say, "Pat, how are you doing?" And I was proud to say that he is doing well. I`m in a state of shock now.
This is an affable, congenial, elegant man who`s always dressed to the nines. He`s got a Beverly Hills office. He`s got a fabulous web site and he`s very interested in the African-American community. He`s done a lot of good. And so it`s just a shock to my system to hear any of this tonight about him. I can see where people could fall under - I don`t want to see foul because we don`t know that he`s done anything wrong. But boy, he sure looks good on paper. Let`s put it that way.
HAMMER: Yes, and as we reported, though, Donda West reportedly had approached another doctor, a guy named Dr. Andre Aboolian, before she went to Dr. Adams. Aboolian had told "Access Hollywood" why he turned her away. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDRE ABOOLIAN, PLASTIC SURGEON: She was interested in some kind of cosmetic procedures. We had discussed that in order for her to go through with the procedures which she was a good candidate for, she needed what`s called a medical clearance, which is just about anybody over the age of 40 is required to have.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: And Donda West was 58 years old. Now, Dr. Perlman, let me ask you, this happens all the time in Hollywood, doesn`t it? One doctor says no. Eventually people will find somebody who says yes.
DR. JON PERLMAN, PLASTIC SURGEON: Well, there is a tendency for patients to seek out a plastic surgeon willing to do what they`d like to get accomplished. The problem is, there are sometimes risks involved. We really don`t know, A.J., the exact circumstances of this unfortunate death. But it`s tragic and it`s a devastating loss and our sympathies go out to the family.
The fact of the matter is too many people take unnecessary risks in selecting a plastic surgeon perhaps based on cost as a factor, perhaps based on the fact he`s willing to accomplish two or three procedures under one prolonged anesthesia. But the patient shouldn`t be making those decisions. They`re unaware of the real risks that are involved.
When a board certified plastic surgeon by the American Board of Plastic Surgery works in an accredited facility, the risks are extremely small. One in fewer than 50,000 deaths will - people will die under elective cosmetic surgery. Unfortunately, it does happen and oftentimes it`s because of poor choices that were made.
HAMMER: And to your point, I mean, you know, sometimes people will do it perhaps for budgetary reasons, I think. In this case, Donda West, Kanye West - I`m sure money was no object, but it really comes down to another thing that you said and we don`t know what the case was here.
So many people will perhaps be willing to take a risk because of the desire to look a certain way. We talk all the time about the pressures in Hollywood to look younger, to have a certain look, and the cosmetic surgery business is booming. Now, you just mentioned, Doctor, that only one in 50,000 cosmetic surgeries results in a death.
Pat Lalama, let me ask you, do you at all think this death will give stars or people out there in Hollywood or anywhere for that matter, pause before getting on that plastic surgeon bus?
LALAMA: You know, A.J., I hope so. When I came here 20 years ago from Chicago, one of the first stories that I covered were young women getting plastic surgery from a doctor up on Sunset Strip.
And they - oh my god, I was in a state of shock when I saw what they looked like. This was not a board certified doctor. But these young women were so desperate, the pressure to be beautiful and perfect - Now, I was in a dog park the other day, A.J. with five 10-year-old girls who wanted to pet my dogs. I`d never met them before.
One of them said to me, "Can I ask you a question, do you think I`m fat?" I nearly fell over. I swear to god I was in a state of shock. We know Tara Reid, Kathy Griffin have had problems. I don`t know what kind of doctors they went to. But we`ve got to get over this idea that the knife is going to make us happy inside and successful. Somebody has got to pull this plug, A.J. It`s out of control.
HAMMER: Dr. Perlman, let me ask you very quickly. Why don`t you go ahead and respond to Pat. We have about 20 seconds.
PERLMAN: Well, I think she`s right. There`s a problem that Hollywood aggrandizes surgery, glorifies it and makes it seem simple and risk free. And properly done cosmetic surgery is very low risk, but patients beware. Be certain to do your research. Choose carefully. Have it done the right way. Look for a board certified plastic surgeon who is qualified and who`s going to do it safely for you.
HAMMER: Well said. Can`t be said enough if you`re going to go through it. Pat Lalama and Dr. Jon Perlman, thank you both for being with us.
LALAMA: Thank you, A.J.
PERLMAN: My pleasure.
ANDERSON: Such a sad, tragic story, A.J. We`re moving now to Lindsay Lohan outrage. You know, Lindsay has begun serving time for her, not one, but two DUIs. But she`s not behind bars. She`s helping out at a blood bank. And that`s got a lot of people`s blood boiling, and I totally understand why. Did Lindsay get off too easy? That`s next. Also this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FLEEMAN: He is still recovering from his romance with Jennifer Lopez.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: You know that Ben Affleck really got ripped in two when he was dating Jennifer Lopez. But, wow, has this guy changed so much. Look at what he`s been through - rehab, he won an Oscar. Now he`s a family guy. He`s married to Jen Garner. They have a daughter together. It`s really amazing. Coming up. I`ve got a revealing look at Ben Affleck`s stunning transformation.
ANDERSON: A.J., you`ve got to listen to this. There`s a controversial study out there that claims curvy women are smarter than skinny ones. I`m kind of skeptical. I mean does that mean that Jennifer Lopez is smarter than Keira Knightley? Come on. "Grading On a Curve." We`ve got it at 30 after.
ANDERSON: Welcome back to SHOWBIZ TONIGHT, TV`s most provocative entertainment news show. I`m Brooke Anderson in Hollywood. Tonight, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT can tell you that Lindsay Lohan has started serving her sentence for, not one, but two DUI convictions. But she`s still out for blood.
Let me explain. You see Lindsay is not behind bars but working at the American Red Cross Blood Bank in L.A. This is part of the plea deal that she struck back in August. Under that deal, Lindsay will spend one day in jail, do ten days of community service, and complete a drug treatment program.
But wait a minute. Has Lindsay Lohan gotten off too easily? With us tonight, in Hollywood, Ken Seeley, lead interventionist on A & E`s show, "Intervention." Also from Hollywood, investigative journalist and author of "Secrets Can Be Murder," Jane Velez-Mitchell.
Ken, I want to begin with you because you have said time and time again right here on this show that Lindsay needs what you call stiff punishment to really teach her a lesson. Is community service at a blood bank what you would call strict punishment or is this in a way really doing her a disservice?
KEN SEELEY, LEAD INTERVENTIONIST, "INTERVENTION": Yes, Brooke, this is a joke. What they`re doing with her is giving the public the information that`s not acceptable. They`re telling everybody that it`s OK to go out there and drink and drive and you could get away with doing community service.
That`s not acceptable. She needs to be accountable and serve the time that is necessary. That you`re supposed to serve for those types of breaking the laws. It`s not acceptable.
ANDERSON: Well, under this plea agreement, Lindsay - under the agreement that she took, she will need to face 24 hours of jail time before the end of the year. Jane, Hollywood history tells us all they have to do is show up, minutes later, they`re out the door. Look at what happened to Nicole Richie. In and out, 82 minutes. What do you think about this situation?
JANE VELEZ-MITCHELL, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST: Brooke, I`m laughing because it is a joke. This entire thing has made a mockery of the criminal justice system, the way it was handled from the beginning. This was no ordinary DUI.
According to people who were with Lindsay during the last incident, she drove over, allegedly, somebody`s foot, commandeered a vehicle with two people inside, went on a high-speed chase through Malibu into Santa Monica going through red lights, all the while saying, "I`m not going to get into trouble. I`m a celebrity." Guess what? She was right.
A poor minority would have been charged with car jacking, with kidnapping, with assault with a deadly weapon, using a vehicle, and would be in jail doing hard time right now. Let me tell you, this is emblematic of our two-tiered system of justice. It`s time that Americans wake up and say enough. If you`re blonde and pretty, you still have to go to jail if you break the law.
ANDERSON: No special treatment here for high profile people. That`s what you want to see going forward. And I know that people who allege they were there said they were terrified and frightened for their lives.
Ken, I want to talk about this now. Lindsay has been seen out and about with a guy that she met in rehab, a new boyfriend. It seems on one hand, she is trying in some way to get her act together with the community service. But can a rehab boyfriend be a distraction in recovery?
SEELEY: Yes. That`s one of the first things you learn in treatment is that you don`t get in a relationship. You don`t start a relationship in your early recovery. And when you do, what ends up happening is you switch your addiction from drugs and alcohol to your relationship and that becomes your higher power. And that`s what we`re seeing happening right now with her. And what she`s doing is she`s stepping back and she`s not out in the spotlight but we`ll see it. I guarantee you, we will see it in the future.
ANDERSON: Well, Jane, what do you think about that? Because she isn`t out in the spotlight right now. She has kept a low profile since returning to L.A. from rehab. Do you think that will be a new Lindsay that we will see?
VELEZ-MITCHELL: I hope so. I don`t really blame her at this point. I blame the criminal justice system. She has been keeping a low profile. She did show up for the community service at the Red Cross in a Los Angeles suburb. I think she would have learned more if she had served - told to sweep streets, you know, in downtown L.A. to see how the other half lives.
Right now, she appears to be doing all the right things, but we don`t know what`s going on inside her. They say the only thing that has to change is everything. Has she gone from a girl who is driving at 100 miles an hour saying, "I can get away with it because I`m a celebrity," to a humble person willing to be of service? That`s quite a trick. I hope she`s managed it, but we`ll have to wait and see.
ANDERSON: Well, yes, I hope she`s managed it, too. Ken, what are your thoughts. What does she need to do after the ten days of community service? Because from your perspective, when you`ve worked with people in recovery, do they sometimes view community service like, say, jury duty, something you just have to do and then you forget about it, you move on. It doesn`t really make an impact on you.
SEELEY: Yes. This will be no impact whatsoever on her. She`ll forget about it in a month guaranteed. But if she went to jail, she wouldn`t forget about that in a month. My only hope in her situation right now is when she goes through this alcohol program that they sentenced her. That`s where I think she`ll get the help.
ANDERSON: Hopeful she will. I sure hope she`s dedicated enough to continue her recovery. Ken Seeley, Jane Velez-Mitchell, thank you both.
VELEZ-MITCHELL: Thanks, Brooke.
HAMMER: Well, now we want to hear from you for our SHOWBIZ TONIGHT question of the day. Here`s what we`re asking. Community service for Lindsay: Did she get off too easy? You can go to CNN.com/ShowbizTonight or e-mail us. Showbiztonight@cnn.com is our address, from your laptop, your desktop, your laptop, even if you have one of those, a Blackberry, whatever it is, and whatever you want to tell us.
ANDERSON: Hey, A.J., Julia Roberts is really opening up about young, out- of-control Hollywood stars like Lindsay. And you won`t believe who Julia would turn to for advice if her own kids wanted to be actors. We`ve got that next. Also this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIKE FLEEMAN, WEST COAST EDITOR, "PEOPLE" MAGAZINE: This was the hottest of the hot Hollywood romances and it burned so hot that it seemed to almost consume Ben Affleck.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: Ben Affleck really took a beating when he was dating Jennifer Lopez, from the press I`m talking about. You know, he`s changed so much, rehab, won an Oscar, now he`s a family guy, married to Jen Garner. They have a beautiful daughter together. It`s amazing. Coming up, a revealing look at Ben Affleck`s stunning transformation.
ANDERSON: I can`t wait for that, A.J. And speaking of Jennifer Lopez, get a load of this. A controversial new report claims that women who are curvy like J. Lo are smarter than skinny women. And the people behind the study say they can prove it. But, come on, are you kidding me? Coming up, grading stars on a curve. 30 after.
HAMMER: And now you can watch SHOWBIZ TONIGHT anytime at all, just by downloading our podcast. And the best thing of all, it is totally free. If you`re looking for the SHOWBIZ TONIGHT podcast, you need to look no further than our web site, CNN.com/ShowbizTonight. You can also download it on iTunes by typing "SHOWBIZ TONIGHT" in the search box. SHOWBIZ TONIGHT is coming right back.
HAMMER: I`ll be honest with you. Julia Roberts is one of my favorite Hollywood actresses, totally a class act. She`s married to cameraman Danny Moder. She`s a great mom to three kids.
Well, Julia has turned 40 and she is opening up like never before about motherhood, the paparazzi, and young Hollywood. In a revealing interview with "Vanity Fair," Julia gets pretty emotional.
She says, quote, "There`s no reason to take pictures of celebrities` children other than people to say, `Oh, they`re cute.` I think magazines shouldn`t run pictures of people`s kids. I think it`s just grotesque. It`s like a circus sideshow. I don`t know why anybody would even want to go into show business these days with all of the different magazines and shows. It just wouldn`t be worth it."
Now, Julia also says that if her kids did want to act, she would look to actress Natalie Portman`s parents as an example because she thinks they really brought her up the right way. Well, we caught up with Natalie who`s now starring in the new movie "Mr. Magorium`s Wonder Emporium," and she agrees. Her parents got it right.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NATALIE PORTMAN, ACTRESS: Well, it was really, really kind of her to say that. And I think the main thing was that they were supporting my sort of creativity, but they weren`t trying to profit off of it. Because I think a lot of the danger with kid actors is that most of the time their parents put them in to, like, make money for the family. And a kid shouldn`t be under that pressure.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: Well said, Natalie. By the way, you can read more of Julia Roberts` interview in the December issue of "Vanity Fair." It`s on newsstands now.
ANDERSON: Hey, A.J., Julia Roberts might be cool with taking parenting advice from Natalie Portman`s folks, but what about from Britney Spears? Yes, she`s not exactly parent of the year but Heidi Klum learned some useful baby stuff from Britney. Yes, really. You`ve got to hear this. Next.
HAMMER: Well, like Britney, Nicole Kidman went through a divorce involving kids. You remember she was married to Tom Cruise, of course. Tonight, she is really opening up about what it was like on her kids.
ANDERSON: A.J., you have got to listen to this. There is a controversial study out there that claims that curvy women are smarter than skinny ones. But come on. So does that mean that Jennifer Lopez is smarter than Keira Knightley? "Grading On a Curve." That`s straight ahead. SHOWBIZ TONIGHT is coming right back. Keep it here.
HAMMER: On SHOWBIZ TONIGHT, "Grading On the Curve." Could it be true? Can you possibly tell how smart a woman is by her waist and her hips? Yes, it sounds crazy, but a study says there`s a formula from J. Lo, to Keira Knightley, Beyonce to Salma Hayek. Tonight, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT is "Grading On the Curve." Also this.
FLEEMAN: He is still recovering from his romance with Jennifer Lopez.
HAMMER: Ben Affleck seems so happy with Jennifer Garner. But, you know, not so long ago, it was about another Jennifer and they were all over the tabloids. So how did Ben go from Oscar winner to tabloid target and back again? Tonight, the transformation of Ben Affleck.
HAMMER: Welcome back to SHOWBIZ TONIGHT. It`s 30 minutes past the hour. I`m A.J. Hammer broadcasting tonight and every night from New York City.
ANDERSON: And I`m Brooke Anderson coming to you tonight from Hollywood. You are watching TV`s most provocative entertainment news show. Tonight, it is the story all America was talking about at the water cooler, "Grading On a Curve."
Researchers have found the ratio between a woman`s waist and hips can reveal just how smart they are. Supposedly, you can calculate a magic formula that will tell you just where you fall into the whole thing. So, of course, here on SHOWBIZ TONIGHT, we`re going to explain this to you and how the biggest stars are not so bright.
Here is how you get the formula. We`ll use the beautiful and curvaceous Jennifer Lopez as our example. Her waist size, 26 inches. Pretty tiny waist. Well, researchers say if you divide her waist size by her hip size, which is a nice 39 inches, tadah, you get the magic number. For J.Lo, that number is a beautiful 0.66.
The way the researchers figure the lower the magic number the higher your IQ. But, I want to know how much truth is there really to this study. Joining me tonight from Miami, Steve Santagati, author of "The Manual." Tonight, in New York, clinical psychologist, Dr. Judy Kuriansky. Good to see you both.
And here is the deal, guys. Researchers say it`s all about this magic number which is really just the ratio of your hips to your waist. And the way they explain it, the fat on your hips and thighs actually has an acid in it that`s pure brain food. Steve Santagati, do you buy it? Omega-3 fatty acid.
STEVE SANTAGATI, AUTHOR, "THE MANUAL": Omega-3 - exactly. Which is in salmon, too. According to this study, Jessica Rabbit and Pamela Anderson are rocket scientists. The only thing this study is going to do is three things. Number one, it`s going to make women yet more paranoid about their figure and about their body. They`re all measuring their waist and hips, do I fall in that 0.6 or 0.7 ratio, and if not, they are a complete failure.
Or the women that are delusional are going to keep eating and not do any exercise, thinking, "Oh, the bigger I get, the smarter I get." The third type of woman who is smart enough to go, "This is just science, it`s no big deal."
ANDERSON: Dr. Judy, what do you think? Does it make any sense to you? Do you think women could have more of a complex, maybe, because of this thing?
JUDY KURIANSKY, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: There`s no question about more of a complex. And I would say please, women, do not fall into what we call the beauty trap thinking you have to measure up to some ideal. It was not too long ago and it still goes on, right, that women are looking at the model who is stick thin and that`s supposed to be the most attractive. So those don`t really work.
But here is what I want women to also know, there are different kinds of intelligence. This research was based on a test of critical thinking, OK? A cognitive test. There`s "G" intelligence, which is more general. Women have a lot of what we call emotional intelligence which is how they understand people and can relate to people.
SANTAGATI: I beg to differ.
KURIANSKY: And there are lots of other kinds of intelligences that are not that kind of critical thinking. So you should not say that your waist to your hips makes the difference.
ANDERSON: And it kind of made me giggle a little bit. The researchers tested their data from a study of more than 16,000 women aged from birth to 90. Little babies and little curves, I guess. But I want to play a game right now. According to this study, you have to hit this magic number somewhere between 0.6, 0.7. Too high or too low, sorry, you`re not so smart according to the study. So if you apply to the rules of the study, which of these actresses do you think is smarter, Keira Knightley or Mira Sorvino? Steve, very quickly.
SANTAGATI: Keira Knightley.
ANDERSON: Dr. Judy?
KURIANSKY: I think they`re both gorgeous.
SANTAGATI: Oh, she saw me. Just pick one.
KURIANSKY: They`re both intelligent.
ANDERSON: I`m sure they are both very smart.
KURIANSKY: As I`ve said, intelligence is different. And street smart has a lot to do with it, too. So Mira Sorvino has a lot of street smart.
SANTAGATI: All right. Go ahead.
ANDERSON: According to this study the answer is Harvard educated Mira Sorvino, she got a 0.69 here. Keira Knightley a 0.76. But here`s an important point. Keira is not the only one who didn`t get in that magic number range. We at SHOWBIZ TONIGHT did an informal study with beautiful bright, young women on our staff and none of them hit within this range.
ANDERSON: Steve, go ahead.
SANTAGATI: Brooke, here is the thing, OK? They did this a long time ago. I saw it on "Discovery Health." Women like broad shoulders on men and certain other attributes, height and what not. Men like that ratio, that 0.66 or that 0.7. That is what`s genetically ingrained in our brains to be attracted to.
But more importantly, now in this day and age - and I`m not being nice. I think we`re all clear on that - is that men like well-rounded women, meaning you have to have a decent figure whatever your body type. You don`t have to be perfect. But you have to, you know, take care of yourself. And you have to have a career and a life and some ideas and some hobbies and some things. We like well-rounded women. Who cares what the ratio is?
KURIANSKY: I can`t (UNINTELLIGIBLE)
ANDERSON: Well-rounded in more ways than one. Go ahead, Dr. Judy
KURIANSKY: But I disagree with that entirely because there is an anthropological reason for this, that big hips meant that the woman could carry babies and that`s what the guys wanted to do was have more babies. So that`s anthropological. But I have to disagree.
I`m surprised I`m taking your point of view here, Steve, that there are different strokes for different folks when it comes to guys, too. Can`t we say that Nicole Kidman is pretty smart and pretty gorgeous and attractive and has it up in her brains and everywhere else.
SANTAGATI: Not my type.
KURIANSKY: And she`s tall and thin and she`s not really in that shapely Barbie doll look.
ANDERSON: Steve, you were shaking head no there.
KURIANSKY: Neither is Hilary Swank for that reason, and she`s sexy and smart, too.
ANDERSON: Well, Steve, you were shaking your head no. Do you think you can look at a woman and determine if she is or isn`t smart?
SANTAGATI: Yes, if she goes out with me, she`s stupid.
KURIANSKY: Well -
ANDERSON: We think we can agree on that.
KURIANSKY: I`ll tell you something. The way that men can tell and that women can tell how smart a woman is, is though her eye contact.
SANTAGATI: And how she carries herself.
KURIANSKY: And how she carries herself, and if she`s really able to look at you.
ANDERSON: A number of factors. A number of factors. We do have to end it there. Dr. Judy Kuriansky, Steve Santagati, thank you both.
SANTAGATI: Thank you.
HAMMER: Heidi Klum says she and Seal still have a lot of romance in their marriage even though they`re busy with their kids and careers. Heidi told Ellen DeGeneres they make time for romance. Heidi says it`s kind of like, "Hey, baby, 2:00 in the attic, 6:00 in the front closet." Well, Ellen thought that was a great idea and had another suggestion that Heidi really seemed to like. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEGENERES: I was talking to Christina Aguilera and she said they have naked Sundays, that every Sunday they`re naked, she and her husband.
HEIDI KLUM, SUPERMODEL: I love that.
DEGENERES: Yes. Just naked all day long.
KLUM: I think we might have to copy on doing that.
DEGENERES: Yes, you should.
KLUM: I could actually do like a whole, you know, Sunday come over. Heidi and Seal`s naked Sunday. No?
DEGENERES: Are you inviting me?
DEGENERES: I would love to.
KLUM: Yes? DEGENERES: I would love to.
KLUM: Why not? That would be fun.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: All right. Ellen also took Heidi to task for not inviting her to her Halloween party. As it turns out, Britney Spears crashed that very same party.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEGENERES: Britney Spears went? She was invited?
KLUM: She wasn`t.
DEGENERES: She wasn`t invited?
KLUM: No. So you could have come, too, uninvited.
DEGENERES: Wow. And I had a better outfit than that.
DEGENERES: She just showed up? She just invited herself? Did you talk to her?
KLUM: I did.
DEGENERES: What did you talk about?
KLUM: You know, we were talking about babies and diapers. And she explained to me a lot of things about diapers that I didn`t know.
KLUM: You know the sticky things on the side - I never knew that they were there. I just closed them in the front. I was always, you know, putting string around. I had no idea.
KLUM: It`s very clever. I learned a lot of things.
DEGENERES: You learned a lot from Britney. That`s fantastic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: It`s pretty funny. Heidi, by the way, dressed up like a cat for Halloween. And she had a tag on her that said, "If found, return to Seal." These guys are so unbelievably cute.
Ben Affleck seems happy with Jennifer Garner, his wife. But, you know, not so long ago it was all about another Jennifer.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FLEEMAN: This was the hottest of the hot Hollywood romances and it burned so hot that it seemed to almost consume Ben Affleck.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HAMMER: So how did it all happen? How did Ben go from Oscar winner, to tabloid target, and then back again? Tonight you will not want to miss the transformation of Ben Affleck.
ANDERSON: And Nicole Kidman speaks out about going through a divorce when kids are involved and how to stay focused with all that tabloid attention. Nicole in her own words, coming up.
HAMMER: Thank you. Welcome back to SHOWBIZ TONIGHT, TV`s most provocative entertainment news show. I`m A.J. Hammer in New York. Tonight SHOWBIZ TONIGHT has a lesson for so many young Hollywood stars who want that big career but they can`t seem to get there. And this lesson can be learned from none other than Ben Affleck.
Sure he started off big winning the Oscar for his movie "Goodwill Hunting." But then, Ben seemed to kind of lose his way. His career wasn`t what he hoped it would be, and then the press attention he was receiving was all for his hot and heavy romance with Jennifer Lopez. So how did Ben Affleck go from Oscar winning actor to target of the tabloids to back on top of his career with a happy private life to boot? SHOWBIZ TONIGHT investigates.
(voice over): It`s an Oscar story for Hollywood`s history books. The year 1998, a baby faced Ben Affleck standing beside his childhood best friend Matt Damon, positively glowing backstage at the Oscars with their golden statuettes in hand. They had just won the Oscar for their labor of love, the movie "Goodwill Hunting."
BEN AFFLECK, ACTOR: We never thought that anyone would buy it or it would actually go through the Hollywood sort of channels, much less end up winning Academy Awards, for god`s sake.
HAMMER: Ben Affleck, the star, was born.
FLEEMAN: Ben burst onto the scene with huge expectations.
HAMMER: Huge expectations indeed. After all, he was a local boy from Boston who made small, edgy indie films with a director named Kevin Smith, like Smith`s "Chasing Amy."
AFFLECK: Just having a little girl trouble.
HAMMER: But after his Oscar win, Ben moved on to big budget films like "Armageddon.".
AFFLECK: We`re all going to die, right?
HAMMER: But with the fame, the offers, the money and a curse. "People" magazine`s west coast editor Mike Fleeman.
FLEEMAN: Right after he does "Goodwill Hunting," he makes "Armageddon," this huge Michael Bay explosion sci-fi extravaganza. And it wasn`t really what people expected from him. They thought maybe he could be something deeper, that he could be a true actor, a true artist and not just a movie star.
HAMMER: But movie star was fitting Ben Affleck quite well. In fact, he seemed to be enjoying it, even falling in love with his co-star from "Shakespeare in Love," Gwyneth Paltrow, his first big Hollywood romance.
FLEEMAN: That was an Oscar-caliber movie but he had a small part, sort of playing a version of himself. He did come out of that, dating Gwyneth Paltrow and that was the first of the sort of huge Hollywood romances that would come to eclipse his career.
HAMMER: You can say that again after Ben and Gwen ended their relationship, Ben met someone else on a movie set, this time for a movie named "Gigli." The year was 2002 and the girl, a music diva named Jennifer Lopez. The two were joined at the hip and fast becoming the hot new couple making headlines around the world.
FLEEMAN: Long before we had Brangelina, we had Bennifer, and that was Ben Affleck and Jennifer Lopez. This was the hottest of the hot Hollywood romances and it burned so hot that it seemed to almost consume Ben Affleck.
HAMMER: Consume him, it almost did. But before we get to that, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT has got to ask, just how did Ben Affleck go from Oscar winning actor to headline in the tabloids back to an actor and director who is making big waves at award season once again with his new movie "Gone Baby Gone?" It`s a lesson for so many young stars in Hollywood who want that big Hollywood career.
KURIANSKY: Ben is an excellent lesson for young Hollywood because he had that meteoric rise, then he had that fall, float down. Then he tried the celebrity let`s-hook-up with the really cool and amazing woman when he and Jennifer Lopez got together.
HAMMER: A hookup just right for the tabloids.
FLEEMAN: He made two mistakes. One, he made a lousy movie, "Gigli." At the same time, he is dating his co-star.
JENNIFER LOPEZ, ACTRESS: What is it you`re supposed to say?
AFFLECK: I`ve got this beautiful, sexy, unattainable girl, sleeping in a bed right next to me.
HAMMER: It was a romance that the press just couldn`t seem to get enough of. The interest in Bennifer was so high, in fact, that shortly after they were engaged, the two did an exclusive interview for NBC`s news magazine show "Dateline."
PAT O`BRIEN, HOST, "DATELINE": What`s the most extravagant thing you bought her?
AFFLECK: I would say engagement ring. That`s probably the thing that men spend the most money on in there. Correct?
HAMMER: Spend, he did. Ben bought Jen a six carat pink diamond stunner. The media hype on Bennifer was in overdrive. And the couple didn`t really do much to calm the frenzy either. Ben even starred in Jen`s music video for her song "Jenny on the Block."
KURIANSKY: When you take a look at Ben Affleck in the video with J. Lo, it`s obvious that this is not a good career move for him nor a good personal move for him. He looks uncomfortable. Everybody else feels uncomfortable watching it.
FLEEMAN: He was buying her Rolls-Royces. They were hitting the party scene. It was crazy.
HAMMER: And even crazier times ahead when the duo postponed and then scrapped their media-hyped wedding altogether. The couple blames the media for their split.
FLEEMAN: Things got so crazy that the fact that they didn`t have a wedding became a big story.
HAMMER: Ben blamed the media when he went on "LARRY KING LIVE" in 2004.
AFFLECK: Relationships are difficult propositions under any circumstances. And there are a lot of difficulties in everyday life. Those are magnified when it`s in that degree of scrutiny all the time.
HAMMER: And Ben learned something from his Bennifer years. Keeping his romance out of the spotlight and working hard on his career was the only way to go. It was on the set of "Daredevil" he met and fell in love with co-star Jennifer Garner.
And then, you didn`t hear from them. Nothing, until June 2005 when they got married. Ben became a father to their baby Violet in December of that same year. His career came calling once again with a great little movie called "Hollywood Land."
FLEEMAN: "Hollywood Land" was a very good movie that very few people saw. But it was a turning point for Ben Affleck. It showed the world that he really is a good actor.
HAMMER: And now, in 2007, Ben`s name is already being thrown around in this year`s Oscar race, this time for his directorial debut for his movie "Gone, Baby, Gone."
AFFLECK: Great. Cut. Great. Cut.
HAMMER: Something had changed, and it was no longer about the fame, the fortune. It was about the family and even Ben can`t ignore the coincidence that being happy in his personal life has meant good things for his career. Just listen to him explain it to CNN`s Larry King.
AFFLECK: You know, if you get to a point in your life where you think, "Look, my personal life. I`m married and I`m really happy." You know, that part of my life is really great. And, look, at the same time I`m in the best place I`ve ever been professionally. Is that a coincidence or did those things happen simultaneously?
KURIANSKY: That`s just proof of the pudding, that you can lead a private life and be successful without the false hoopla.
HAMMER: Dr. Judy, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT couldn`t have said it any better.
HAMMER: Ben directed his brother, Casey Affleck in "Gone, Baby, Gone." And Casey, just like his big bro, is getting a lot of early Oscar buzz as well.
ANDERSON: On Monday, we asked you to vote on our SHOWBIZ TONIGHT question of the day. It was this - Heather Mills: Should she just shut up already? Ninety-four percent of you say, "Yes, she should." Six percent of you say, "No, she shouldn`t." Here are some of the e-mails that we received.
Judy, from North Carolina writes, "Heather Mills is not getting more fans with her rants. She should take a lesson from her soon-to-be ex and behave more maturely." Fawn from Florida says, " She wants our sympathy, but she is the one causing all of her own problems. Paul has said nothing over this divorce." And we do appreciate your e-mails. Keep them coming.
All right, Nicole Kidman speaking out about going through divorce when you have kids. And with her, it wasn`t just a divorce; it was a divorce from one of the biggest stars in the world, Tom Cruise. We`ve got Nicole Kidman in her own words. You don`t want to miss that. Coming up next right here on SHOWBIZ TONIGHT.
ANDERSON: Nicole Kidman is opening up about going through a divorce when kids are involved. She and Tom Cruise, you may remember, divorced after 10 years of marriage. They adopted two children together.
In an interview with "Marie Claire" magazine, Nicole said this when asked about how hard divorce can be on kids, quote, "It can be argued that you shouldn`t have gotten divorced and that`s true, but sometimes you don`t have a decision in that. People fall out of love. They do. If you go through a divorce, it`s how you behave within that time that`s really important for what your son and daughter see."
Now for more of that interview with Nicole Kidman, pick up a copy of "Marie Claire" magazine. It`s on newsstands now. And by the way, SHOWBIZ TONIGHT also spoke with Nicole. She stars with Jennifer Jason Leigh in "Margot at the Wedding," which Jennifer`s husband wrote and directed.
We talked to Nicole and Jennifer about what it takes to stay focused with all the tabloid attention that surrounds stars of today. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NICOLE KIDMAN, ACTRESS: It`s protecting yourself and learning, and really being honest with yourself about what you want and why you`re doing it. And if it is a pure artistic motive, which, you know, you look at Jennifer and Noah. I mean there`s a group of people that exists in this industry still that that is the motive. And I would hope I`m in that group where you just say this is what it is. And all the other stuff will come and go and ebb and flow, but ultimately, you know, I`d like to be 80 and doing a play in the village.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: You can see Nicole Kidman and Jennifer Jason Leigh in "Margot at the Wedding" in theaters this Friday.
HAMMER: We`ve been asking you to vote on our SHOWBIZ TONIGHT question of the day. Here`s what we need to know from you tonight. Community service for Lindsay: Did she get of to easy? Continue to vote at CNN.com/ShowbizTonight. Or you can e-mail us at firstname.lastname@example.org from your desktop or your laptop, your blackberry, your cell phone. Whatever it is you want to tell us, please tell us.
Now let`s find out what`s coming up on SHOWBIZ TONIGHT. On Wednesday, Britney versus K-Fed in court. So the question is, will Kevin Federline`s lawyers try to use paparazzi video of Britney against her. What will be the latest twists and turns in their custody battle? Because you know there are going to be some. SHOWBIZ TONIGHT all over it, Wednesday.
Also, yes, it`s that time of year again to name the Sexiest Man Alive. So who is going to make the cover of "People" magazine this time around? Brad, George, Matthew? Maybe somebody totally new. The sexiest man alive, Wednesday on SHOWBIZ TONIGHT.
And that is it for SHOWBIZ TONIGHT. Thanks a lot for watching. I`m A.J. Hammer in New York.
ANDERSON: I`m Brooke Anderson in Hollywood. The latest from CNN "HEADLINE NEWS" is coming up next. Take care.