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CNN NEWSNIGHT AARON BROWN
East Coast Braces for Hurricane; 9th Circuit Court of Appeals Postpones Recall Election; Battle Over Texas Redistricting Continues
Aired September 15, 2003 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening again everyone.
It turns out storm clouds are building on both coasts tonight. The more predictable Hurricane Isabel is slowly making its nasty way towards the East Coast. When asked where it would make landfall, one expert said today probably the Outer Banks but we could be off by 250 miles.
The other storm erupted this afternoon out west, the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, often called the most liberal appeals court in the country, put the kibosh on the California recall for a few months.
One legal mind reading the decision said it seemed the Ninth Circuit was trying to get the U.S. Supreme Court to eat its words in Bush v. Gore. The political ruling from a court, imagine that. It's where we begin the whip tonight.
CNN's Candy Crowley joins us, Candy a headline from you please.
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, is this about the politics of law or the laws of politics? Either way a court has rocked the vote in California ordering a delay of the October 7 recall. It seems we have passed this way before.
BROWN: It does. Candy, we'll get back to you at the top tonight.
CNN's Jeanne Meserve is on the Virginia coast, the expected path of Hurricane Isabel, Jeanne a headline from you.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, Isabel is packing such a wallop the Navy has decided to move its ships out to sea and its aircraft inland to try and minimize the damage -- Aaron.
BROWN: Jeanne, thank you.
In Washington, the administration's effort to stay on message where Iraq is concerned, our senior White House correspondent John King the duty tonight, John a headline from you.
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, the president is trying to revitalize public support for his Iraq policy. The vice president is taking a lead role in the effort and to the administration's critics a sense of deja vu. They say this White House is stretching the truth to say the least -- Aaron.
BROWN: John, thank you.
And finally, Austin, Texas, and what you might call the Alamo in reverse. CNN's Ed Lavandera has the headline tonight -- Ed.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Aaron. We've been watching Texas Democrats and Republicans fight over redistricting for four months but what we saw today took it to an all new level. One Austin political expert said it's turned into a nuclear war here so we'll show you what it's like.
BROWN: Well, we'll try at least. Thank you, Ed, back to you and the rest shortly.
Also tonight, they say the best is the enemy of the good in British Columbia, Vancouver at least. The best would be no one using heroin. Instead, there is a heroin epidemic so the good, says the mayor, is giving junkies a safe place to shoot up. As you might imagine others, especially in this country, differ sharply with that policy and we'll take a look at it tonight.
A year after he was thrust into the spotlight during the reign of the sniper case in Washington, D.C. and its suburbs, former police chief Charles Moose has written a book about the experience and the chief joins us tonight.
And where would we be without the rooster, not on basic cable you can count on that, but there it is. Here we are and it can only mean tomorrow morning's papers tonight, all that and more in the hour ahead.
We begin tonight in California where the news today wasn't weather related but it was seismic and like any decent upheaval now there's a mess to contend with. The recall is off, at least for this week. The candidates are jockeying for advantage. The spinners are spinning and, as you might imagine, the litigators have started licking their chops, remind you of anything?
Here again, CNN's Candy Crowley.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY (voice-over): We should have guessed that an unprecedented vote in an unpredictable state would unexpectedly end up in the Supreme Court.
GOV. GRAY DAVIS (D), CALIFORNIA: This recall has been like a roller coaster.
CROWLEY: Monday's ride started to roll when a federal appeals court ruled the recall election can't take place until California replaces those punch card voting machines. They are used in six counties representing about 44 percent of the vote.
REP. DARRELL ISSA (R), CALIFORNIA: A panel of three liberal judges, all appointed by Democrats, are asking us to believe that the very voting systems that were used in the last election to elect Gray Davis...
CROWLEY: You remember punch cards, chads, tri-corner, one corner, hanging, dangling chads? Back to the future, even the rhetoric is so 2000.
MARK ROSENBAUM, ACLU: The decision issues by the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals this morning is a masterpiece. Its insistence that every vote, every vote must count. Every count must be counted.
TOM MCCLINTOCK (R), CALIFORNIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: Of course it's anti-democratic. It's authoritarian. It is -- it is -- it is un-American. It is French.
CROWLEY: It's a huge plus for Gray Davis. The longer this goes on the better for the governor who has in the past month wrestled this recall to its high in the polls. With time he has nothing to gain but votes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you believe the ruling was politically motivated?
ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER (R), CALIFORNIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: I'm sure. Thank you.
CROWLEY: One thing we know for sure nobody knows what will happen next.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The man of the hour, Arnold Schwarzenegger.
CROWLEY: This is the week to call in the big dogs or go to them. Arnold Schwarzenegger, wrestler, action film hero, candidate with an R-rated past sought to reassure the women's vote on "Oprah" and Gray Davis spent a second day looking for a jolt from Bill Clinton's electricity. The show goes on.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY: So, get out your pen and paper, Aaron. Tomorrow or the next day the people who started this recall will go to the Supreme Court and the secretary of state of California who's in charge of elections will have a press conference to tell us whether he wants to go to the Supreme Court or whether he will take this back to the full Court of Appeals. Now you know.
BROWN: No, I don't, not quite yet at least. At the risk of trying to make you a legal expert the people who started the recall do want to take it to the U.S. Supreme Court now. Do they in fact have the legal standing to appeal this case? This was the state of California's case.
CROWLEY: Yes they do, in fact, have the legal standing and they will take it to the Supreme Court. They had an announcement today and said they will now. You know, call Jeffrey Toobin but they say they have it and it indeed is now in the works and they are also talking to the secretary of state so there may be some kind of compromise going on there. We're not really sure.
BROWN: We'll find out. Thank you, Candy, Candy Crowley out in Los Angeles tonight.
Fair to say today's court decision had the program in a bit of a quandary. Do we book a legal expert? There's a legal problem here. Do we book a political expert? What's a highly-respected news program to do?
Neither it turned out, we just booked a smart and interesting observer of this whole situation. Janet Clayton is the editor of the editorial page of the "Los Angeles Times," nice to have you with us.
JANET CLAYTON, EDITOR OF THE EDITORIAL PAGE, "LOS ANGELES TIMES": Thank you.
BROWN: Can you shed any light on whether the people who ran the recall in fact have legal standing to challenge the court's decision?
CLAYTON: Yes they certainly do, Aaron, and they will go, they've already announced.
BROWN: OK.
CLAYTON: To seek some sort of respite from the Supreme Court.
BROWN: The paper on its editorial pages was opposed to the recall. Does the paper think that today's ruling is a good thing?
CLAYTON: No. It's a terrible thing.
BROWN: Because?
CLAYTON: Because it doesn't make any sense. We opposed the recall because it's un-democratic, because we just had an election last year, but the court has now interfered in a situation where the ball was already rolling.
There are people who have already cast absentee ballots for this governor or against this governor and it's too late to stop it now and we think it's a very bad idea and, frankly, it looks like, it has the whiff of politics.
BROWN: Some will see it that way. Do you have confidence -- I don't know. When you're speaking to the editor of an editorial page, I'm not sure if we're asking you or the paper a question here. Do you have confidence that the voting machines that are in use, the punch cards, which include your county, L.A. County, accurately tabulate the vote? And, if they don't, then why not delay it until you have a process that does?
CLAYTON: Well, the thing is the punch card ballot is a problem and they've known that for a long time. That's why they're not going to be using them as of next year, March of next year. But the thing is in the meantime there are also some other things that could be done, short term. You could have more precautions take place. You could have more poll workers. They talk about a higher rate of error and indeed they do have a higher rate of error, but remember that rate of error is only three percent.
So, it's not as if necessarily the whole election would turn on this and, more importantly, it does give the impression that once again the courts, be it the Supreme Court or now here the Appeals Court play by whatever rules that the plaintiffs in the case want them to play by and I think that that's a far more dangerous assumption for people to make and a lot of people are talking in those terms.
BROWN: Are you as certain as a lot of people seem to be that if the ruling stands it plays to the benefit of Governor Davis?
CLAYTON: Well, there's no question that Governor Davis would benefit from a delay; however, I don't know if that's really ideal for him either. Right now he's gaining in the polls.
Does he really want another six months of this? I don't think he does. I think he'd really rather get it over with as long as the trends stay his way. So, yes of course it's to his benefit because he's the incumbent but it's not necessarily a sure bet that it would benefit him long term.
BROWN: Why does it play to his benefit? I mean why does being an incumbent in this situation play to his benefit or not play to his benefit?
CLAYTON: Well, because he's already in office and so the question before us is will he be removed from office or not? Presumably the longer that he has in office the more time there is for his opponents to stumble. Does Arnold Schwarzenegger really want to face another six months of questions that he doesn't answer?
BROWN: And, is there out there, as opposed to I think those of us who are observing this from a fair distance, is there a feeling that Mr. Schwarzenegger has so far successfully avoided answering serious questions about serious issues in the state?
CLAYTON: Yes, he certainly has and he had an appearance today on the "Oprah" show. I rest my case. It's a nice show. It's a wonderful show but it's not a serious issue show. It doesn't get specific about California issues because it's not designed to be that. It's designed to be a great showcase for the people who appear on it and it was a great showcase for him today.
BROWN: A couple more, he took a pretty mean pop at the paper the other day saying the paper is clearly against him. What's the paper's reaction to that?
CLAYTON: Well, again, that's -- there's just no substance to that. The paper has covered this campaign very thoroughly. He is -- Mr. Schwarzenegger has been on the front page more than 60 times during that period. I can't imagine that anyone would think there's been a shortage of publicity for him. Certainly, again, editorially the paper opposes the recall but the paper has covered him fully and fairly as it has every other candidate, every other major candidate in this race.
BROWN: And, over the weekend, again today, former President Clinton was out west campaigning for Gray Davis. Do you think in this sort of race that sort of appearance is helpful?
CLAYTON: Of course it can't hurt the governor. The former president is very popular in California. He's particularly popular in the Black community where he was yesterday but, again, that's playing to base. That's more an effort to get out the vote. It isn't going to turn any votes. It's just an effort to try to inspire the base.
BROWN: But isn't that what it's -- in a sense what it's all about here because this is an odd election and in the end, I guess like all elections but perhaps this one more so, you got to get your people out there. The anti forces seem pretty well organized and pretty well ready. The problem, I guess, for the Democrats is going to be to do the same.
CLAYTON: Yes, that's true and that's one of the reasons why President Clinton is here and why the governor has been pulling out all the stops to try to make sure that people get to the polls.
BROWN: Thanks for joining us. I know you're on deadline. The paper's on deadline. We appreciate your time tonight. Janet, thank you very much.
CLAYTON: Thank you, Aaron.
BROWN: Thank you.
On to the other coast now and to the other storm, that would be our coast and the real storm up and down the eastern seaboard tonight. People have a very tough call to make. When Hurricane Isabel was a category five storm it was easy. Only a fool would stay in place.
But tonight, Isabel has dropped to a category three hurricane, winds of about 125 miles an hour, so tomorrow when hurricane watches are expected to go up, some people might be tempted to stick around. Experts say that would be a big mistake. Because of the wind, the tides, the flooding and all the other things that make large hurricanes a category three is plenty big enough, so dangerous.
From Virginia Beach tonight, here's CNN's Jeanne Meserve.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MESERVE (voice-over): Isabel is so ferocious Navy ships in Norfolk will head to sea to ride her out. For small boat owners on Willoughby Spit, a little spot of land formed by the confluence of two hurricanes in the 1600s, anticipating Isabel means winching and hulling and getting boats out of the water.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The same reason the whole Navy is leaving 1,000 yards from us. It's either safer in the deep water or in the front yard.
MESERVE: Marinas weren't the only ones doing a brisk business. With the trajectory of the storm uncertain, grocery and hardware stores all along the East Coast were racking up sales. From the Carolinas north, residents readied fearing the storm just might hit them.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm preparing, you know. I've got plenty of things to drink to keep, you know, everybody liquefied and a little bit of snack food and thinking about what you could fix without heat.
MESERVE: Property owners braced for the possible onslaught by boarding up windows but, given Isabel's advance billing, some people wondered if that would do any good.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If this thing hits us the way it might hit us I'm not sure you can do anything to prepare for it.
MESERVE: That was not the view of federal, state, and local governments who are girding for the storm by pre-positioning personnel and equipment and, though Isabel is still days away from land, the governor of Virginia has already declared a state of emergency.
GOV. MARK WARNER (D), VIRGINIA: The state police, the National Guard, and state Department of Transportation have also deployed or are in the process of deploying additional resources.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MESERVE: Expected in the next 24 to 36 hours decisions on evacuations. In Virginia Beach, people who live in flood prone areas, mobile homes, people with special sorts of disabilities, people who need electricity to run medical devices are already being advised to consider getting out while the getting out is easy -- Aaron.
BROWN: Jeanne, at the risk of asking my either dumb or totally off the wall question of the day to you, given all the National Guardsmen and women who have been sent to Iraq is there any concern about the number of people they have to use when this thing hits?
MESERVE: Not that I've heard expressed, Aaron. Here in the state of Virginia, the governor has authorized the use of up to 500 National Guardsmen. I've been told that 200 are being mobilized immediately. Another 300 are being held in reserve. They're certainly hoping that's going to be enough to cope with this storm -- Aaron.
BROWN: So, it's not that many. Jeanne, thank you very much, Jeanne Meserve in Virginia Beach. She's part of a team of correspondents who will be covering Isabel when Isabel gets close.
The White House now which spent the day and the weekend getting the message out on Iraq again, from one appearance to the next it seemed at times that everyone from the Marine band on up was exactly on the same page. But now even critics of the president concede his administration excels at staying on message but it is the message itself now coming in for some questions, again, our Senior White House Correspondent John King.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KING (voice-over): The president is unequivocal.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: One thing is for certain, no terrorist organization will ever get a weapon of mass destruction from Mr. Saddam Hussein.
KING: But his critics note no such weapons have been found in Iraq, evidence to them the administration is stretching the truth or making definitive statements about issues that are anything but.
JOSEPH CIRINCIONE, CARNEGIE ENDOWMENT FOR INTERNATIONAL PEACE: The White House sold this war on the cheap. It was going to be a cake walk, low casualties, low cost. We'd be greeted as liberators. We'd be in and out in a matter of months. None of it has turned out to be true.
KING: Consider Vice President Cheney's Sunday appearance on "Meet the Press." He described Iraq as a key geographic base for the September 11 hijackers and said documents recovered in Iraq detail ties with al Qaeda but he offered no details and other administration officials and members of Congress familiar with intelligence matters say they know of no proof the 9/11 hijackers operated out of Iraq.
CIRINCIONE: It was Afghanistan that was the geographic base for the terrorist attacks on September 11, not Iraq.
KING: The vice president also said Sunday the administration did not underestimate post-war cost in Iraq or underestimate the resistance U.S. troops would face but consider these statements back in March from Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz.
PAUL WOLFOWITZ, DEPUTY DEFENSE SECRETARY: There's a lot of money to pay for this. It doesn't have to be U.S. taxpayer money.
KING: And from Vice President Cheney.
DICK CHENEY, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My belief is we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: The president's critics see a pattern of exaggerations and distortions, first in making the case for war, now in defending the administration's post-war policy. But here at the White House, the vice president and others say they stand by their assessments including the belief, they say, that weapons of mass destruction eventually will be found -- Aaron.
BROWN: On the question of cost, the administration has often said it would go the Hill and say well we can't put a number on it. Was there ever a point where anyone either in the budget office or the White House did, in fact, put a best guess number on it and how does that compare to the reality?
KING: Well, remember when they made the first request back before the war it was sixty-something billion dollars. That funding included a plan to bring most of the U.S. troops home. That money, of course, now will be spent on the ongoing military operation, the ongoing reconstruction. Most of those troops will stay for some time.
That original budget envisioned, rightly so, the administration had this part about right, 30 days of major combat then moving into a post-war period. But, again, that original budget also included several billion dollars to bring a lot of the troops home.
Now, the administration is saying $87 billion for the next year, some of that for Afghanistan but most of it for Iraq, $20 billion for reconstruction, $60 billion next year to keep U.S. troops in Iraq.
So, they say their numbers are about right but they also are the same people who said Larry Lindsay was way off, the former Clinton -- I'm sorry Bush economic adviser, when he said about $200 billion, $87 billion plus $70 billion we're getting pretty close to $200 billion.
BROWN: The vice president yesterday said this may not be the last request either so $200 billion is not out of the question.
KING: Not at all.
BROWN: John King, thank you John, our Senior White House Correspondent John King.
Ahead on NEWSNIGHT, Alabamans learn the gritty and unpleasant details of budget cuts coming their way.
While in Texas the Democrats go down fighting in their battle over redistricting.
And later, Charles Moose, who led the Washington, D.C. area sniper investigation joins us to talk about the story of the case.
This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: The state of Texas now and yet another political dust-up with national overtones. Republican state Senators have been trying to redraw congressional districts at the prompting, at least according to the Democrats, of the National Republican leadership.
So, for the past six weeks, the Democrats have been on the lam, out of state, depriving Republicans of a quorum to vote on their plan. Now, one of the Democrats has caved in and that was all the other side needed setting the stage for whatever it was that happened today.
Here's CNN's Ed Lavandera. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LAVANDERA (voice-over): It's a high noon showdown at the Texas state capital.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A quorum, Mr. president, with all those on the floor and in the...
LAVANDERA: There are finally enough legislators in Austin to conduct business but 10 Texas Senate Democrats marching to their own drumbeat have taken over the state Senate chamber. The day's session lasts only a few minutes. Republicans disappear from the floor.
MARIO GALLEGOS, TEXAS SENATE DEMOCRAT: If they were so eager for us to make a quorum and debate the issues on the floor, where are they?
LAVANDERA: All the senators will come back Tuesday, a little time for tempers to cool down, then work begins on the fourth attempt by Republican lawmakers to pass a congressional redistricting bill.
LETICIA VAN DE PUTTE, TEXAS SENATE DEMOCRAT: This fight is not just about congressional lines. It's about the equal voice of each and every Texan being preserved in our system of American democracy.
LT. GOV. DAVID DEWHURST, TEXAS REPUBLICAN: The Senate floor is not, I repeat not the appropriate forum for a political rally.
LAVANDERA: Even veteran political writers, like Dave McNeely, say they've never seen a day quite like this.
DAVE MCNEELY, "AUSTIN AMERICAN STATESMAN": This is sort of a partisan fight gone nuclear.
LAVANDERA: The one Democrat who defected from the so-called Texas 11, had a hard time watching the circus atmosphere.
JOHN WHITMIRE, TEXAS SENATE DEMOCRAT: This is exactly what we had hoped to prevent by bringing some civility back to the state Senate.
LAVANDERA: Republicans are claiming victory saying soon they'll be able to deliver more Republicans to Congress. Democrats still vow it's not over yet.
ROYCE WEST, TEXAS SENATE DEMOCRAT: We did not leave Austin in order to lose. We left Austin in order to win and win we will.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LAVANDERA: Republicans say it's all over. It's just a matter of approving the proper redistricting plan that they have. There are about five to six different maps by most accounts on the table at this point. If the Republicans can agree on one of those, they feel confident they'll be able to pass it. Right now, Republicans have -- or Democrats, rather, have a 17-15 edge in Congress from the Texas delegation. Under any one of these new maps that could give them up to 20 seats and giving Democrats only 12 -- Aaron.
BROWN: Does this ultimately end up in court of is the legislature the last word?
LAVANDERA: Well, it's hard to say. The Democrats have been trying the court angle as well. They've been shot down on a couple different angles. It doesn't mean that they won't keep trying to do that as well. So, it's hard to say at this point where the court angle plays out. The Democrats say they still have a chance to defeat this in the next 30 days during the special session.
BROWN: Ed, thank you very much, Ed Lavandera in Austin, Texas tonight.
When last we left the state of Alabama, voters there had just decided overwhelmingly that they didn't want to pay higher taxes. They voted the way they did in spite of a plea from their conservative Republican governor who said it was not only fiscally necessary but also the Christian thing to do.
Now, he, they, and the Alabama legislature have some tough choices to make about which schools to close, which teachers to fire, which prisoners to release, because the money simply is not there, lawmakers in Alabama meeting in special session tonight, the governor addressing them.
Here's CNN's Gary Tuchman.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Less than a week after voters overwhelmingly turned down his proposal to raise taxes, Alabama's Republican governor told legislators he is ready to do what he has to do.
GOV. BOB RILEY (R), ALABAMA: There will be cuts and they will be painful.
TUCHMAN: Governor Bob Riley says the state is hundreds of millions of dollars in the red so when it comes to a program like the Alabama Coalition Against Domestic Violence...
RILEY: And I applaud the work they continue to do; however, in light of the severity of our crisis, we can no longer afford to financially support programs that are not essential to state government.
TUCHMAN: Also on the chopping block, funding for the Corrections Department, which would result in the early release of less violent prisoners, and funding for the Health Department which would lead to no more free flu shots, and tens of millions of dollars worth of cuts to the kindergarten through 12th grade education budget. CLINTON CARTER, MONTGOMERY CO. ALABAMA SCHOOL SUPERINTENDENT: Statewide there will be teacher layoffs in the state, significant layoffs, and you've heard numbers. I think from 3,000 to 5,000. I think that's realistic.
TUCHMAN: Many of those who voted against the tax hike wanted the governor to make large budget cuts in the first place but some of them are now thinking the governor is trying to punish those who voted against him.
JOHN FILES, ALABAMA CHRISTIAN COALITION: Anytime that you have the concept and the discussion of folks letting prisoners out in the neighborhoods and programs being cut where children and the elderly are impacted that gets public attention and we would hope that you looked at more the administrative cost of things.
TUCHMAN: Alabama is not alone when it comes to state budget problems but Alabamians have not only said no to a tax increase, they've also turned down a state lottery to raise money.
(on camera): Legislators have the final say on slashing the budget and they'll have until October 1, the beginning of the fiscal year, to reach an agreement. If they don't under Alabama law they have another significant problem, the government shuts down.
Gary Tuchman CNN, Montgomery, Alabama.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Coming up on NEWSNIGHT tonight, a plan to help drug addicts shoot up, controversial, maybe but not in the city where it started today, Vancouver, British Columbia, a break first.
From New York, this is NEWSNIGHT.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: In this country, when a state's voters pass a medical marijuana law, the federal government gets apoplectic. We can only imagine what the planners of the war on drugs thought when they heard about Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.
There, as in 50 other major foreign cities, there is now a government-sponsored site where drug addicts can legally inject heroin. Some call it surrender. In Canada, they are calling it smart.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN (voice-over): The spectacular city advertises itself as one of the best places on the planet to live. But it also has a problem nearly as spectacular. And you're looking at it.
He didn't want to give us his name, but he's one of thousands of heroin and crack cocaine addicts who live here in a 2-square-mile area of Vancouver, British Columbia, known as the East Side, so many users that, for a time, police could barely keep up with the violence.
SGT. SCOTT THOMPSON, VANCOUVER POLICE: A lot of gunfire, a lot of shootings, a lot of stabbings every day. Literally, shootings, someone's getting shot about once a week.
BROWN: So because of the violence and because of soaring HIV rates, city officials began looking for something, anything, to tamp down the drug use and the violence. And what they came up with was this: an abandoned storefront in the heart of the East Side that will be North America's first and only place for drug users to legally inject heroin.
DR. PATRICIA DALY, VANCOUVER COASTAL HEALTH AUTHORITY: They will be given clean needles and equipment to inject. If need be, they will counseling on how to safely inject. There will be a nurse who will be present when they inject, but won't help them with the injection. And then they'll be monitored afterwards.
BROWN: Dr. Patricia Daly will be the one in charge.
DALY: I think there is a recognition here that addicts have a health problem, that, yes, drugs are illegal, but we need to approach treatment of the addict from the point of view from the health system, that the legal system throwing addicts in jail is not going to stop drug use.
BROWN: In an American city, that kind of talk coming from a government official would almost certainly get someone fired. Here, Larry Campbell, a former cop and city coroner, ran for office on essentially a one-issue campaign: supporting the legalized clinic. He won going away.
LARRY CAMPBELL, MAYOR OF VANCOUVER: At the peak here, we were having probably -- we peaked out somewhere around a death a day in this province, and most of it right here. I mean, what we're looking at is, we're looking at giving them a chance to stay alive. If you overdose, obviously, in a supervised injection site, you've got a pretty good chance of making it. You have got health care workers there.
BROWN: But even though the clinic is a reality, many cops in Vancouver say it might end up increasing violence and make their hard jobs even tougher.
THOMPSON: It is very conflicting for our guys, because they're thinking, well, what is my role out here?
BROWN: A delegation from the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration came to Vancouver to study the plan.
THOMPSON: I don't think they're very happy with it.
BROWN: But even so, the government here is spending $2 million of public money to make it work, though not a single dime on the heroin. As for the drug users themselves yes, yes, there is a formal organization here to represent them. ROBERT WEPPLER, VANCOUVER AREA NATION ON DRUG USERS: We addicts see it as finally a first step by the government of Canada to take the health and welfare of Canadians first.
BROWN: Incongruous as it may seem, Vancouver is going ahead.
DALY: This has been carefully thought out. It hasn't happened overnight. It's something that we have arrived at after many of years of trying multiple strategies to address the problem.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: How they're dealing with heroin in Vancouver, British Columbia.
A few more items from around the world tonight, South Korea first: 26 people remain unaccounted for after the worst typhoon in the country's history. The storm did more than $1 billion of damage, mostly in the southern end of the peninsula. Nearly 100 people died in the storm. And the government has come under criticism for not handling the evacuations better.
Bad weather grounded a pair of rescue planes today. They were on their way to the South Pole to bring back an ailing contractor at a research station there. Weather permitting, they will get give it a try again tomorrow.
As NEWSNIGHT continues: From loyal police chief to national notoriety, we'll talk with Charles Moose, who ran the D.C. sniper investigation.
We'll take a break first. Around the world, this is NEWSNIGHT.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: A year ago October, Charles Moose was a relatively unknown suburban Washington police chief. But a string of sniper shootings made him perhaps the best known cop in America.
For three weeks, the country was riveted as the murders continued. The chief was the public face of the investigation, frequently talking to reporters, in which he alternately gave out some information about the case and negotiated publicly with the killers as well.
"Three Weeks in October" is the title of the book. Chief Moose has written about his experiences in his life. The writing of the book became such an issue that the chief was criticized by his county and ultimately resigned his job over it.
We're pleased to have him with us tonight.
I don't want to spend all our time on this, but the concern was, you shouldn't be taking money for the book while you're the police chief? Was that the issue?
CHARLES MOOSE, FORMER MONTGOMERY COUNTY POLICE CHIEF: Yes, a question of abuse of office.
BROWN: Abuse of office?
MOOSE: Yes.
BROWN: That seems a little harsh. I can understand their argument, but I don't know.
And you decided to write the book anyway. And part of that, I assume, had to do with the money and part of it had to with the story.
MOOSE: Well, mostly, I think, it had to do with the story, because, certainly, if you look at X number of years remaining as police chief compared to whatever you can make off a book, then having that job is a very good job.
But telling the story, talking about local, state and federal agencies working together, just something that I felt needed to be done.
BROWN: Let's talk about the case some, because we see these guys in court now, but we don't necessarily remember all of the case.
Do you remember the point at which you said, this is something bigger than anything I've had to deal with before?
MOOSE: Yes.
Certainly, in my career in Portland and then certainly in Montgomery County, where we just really don't experience a crime like this, investigations like this, very concerned that we didn't have the capacity to deal with this kind of investigation, and very fortunate to have the federal help come in.
BROWN: Was it on the second shooting that you realized this was big or was it farther down the road?
MOOSE: I think a little bit further down the road, especially when we realized that the crime scenes were pretty bland, not a lot of leads, not a lot of communication, not your normal crime spree.
BROWN: Were you ever close to arresting people other than the two people you arrested?
MOOSE: Yes.
We had a number of individuals that were extremely good suspects, seemed to fit four or five of the criteria to be the suspect, owned a weapon that was similar, but the weapon didn't match up. Other kind of situations eliminated them -- but a number of people that were very good possibles.
BROWN: And how did you -- how did, ultimately, they get eliminated?
MOOSE: Various ways. Some, we were conducting surveillance. I think, once, we were interviewing the people when there was another shooting. And then, again, a number of them actually gave us their weapon and it didn't match.
BROWN: Do you remember when you first heard the names John Malvo and Muhammad, when you first heard their names?
MOOSE: I remember the timeframe when we heard the names. And we started looking into activity in Tacoma, Washington, and then trying to put the puzzle together.
BROWN: And do you remember thinking, "I think we got them -- I think we got the right people this time"? Not "I think we got them," because you had to find them.
MOOSE: Well, certainly, the key was when we found the weapon and the weapon matched up, because, again, a lot of things on a lot of people looked really good. But until you had that weapon, you weren't sure you had people that you could connect.
BROWN: The book is -- it's mostly about the case -- or a lot about the case. But it's also about the life you've led. And I heard you talk about -- or read a quote of yours, actually, about race and the death penalty the other day. And race certainly is part of the book. I suppose it couldn't be otherwise.
MOOSE: Well, certainly, when you look at the platform, you want to talk about the fact that we've made a lot of progress in this country. But you also want to encourage people to continue to work on race issues, to look at equality and look at balance and say that it's something that needs to be a priority, because there is also a tendency to not talk about it, because it's painful for a lot of people.
BROWN: I think the quote I saw -- you say this. You didn't think there would be a lot of joy in the African-American community if, ultimately, these guys are convicted and sentenced to death because of the way the death penalty is applied in the country.
MOOSE: Yes.
Certainly, when you look at statistics, when you talk to people that have, in some strange way, been victimized by the system and perhaps put on death row inappropriately, and you look at the balance, then there is an imbalance there that is very much of a concern to the African-American community. But, at the same hand, when you look at the pain and the suffering from the community, from the victims, from their families, you also have to understand that we are a nation of laws.
And the law -- certainly, the law in the state of Virginia allows for the death penalty.
BROWN: Will you get back in the law enforcement business, do you think? MOOSE: Well, I certainly, in some ways, think so.
I want to try to choose between the private sector, maybe look at a possibility of a university. But I know how to be a cop. I enjoy being a police officer. And I'm not sure I can just go day to day without being a police officer.
BROWN: Nice to meet you.
MOOSE: Thank you, sir.
BROWN: Good luck.
MOOSE: My pleasure to be here.
BROWN: Our pleasure. Nice to have you here. Thank you very much.
Charles Moose, a face you recognize.
Another serial crime story from the Washington, D.C. area leads our national roundup tonight. In the Maryland suburbs of the District of Columbia tonight, authorities are pleading with the personal they believe is a serial arsonist to get in touch with them. So far, 28 fires in Prince George's County in the district have been linked to one individual. A task force -- how familiar does this sound? -- has been established to investigate the fires.
In Los Angeles, police have arrested one person. They say they're looking for as many as four others in connection with the shooting death on Sunday of the 31-year-old half-sister of tennis superstars Venus and Serena Williams. An assault rifle was found at the scene. As many as 20, bullets police say, may have been fired. "Our grief is overwhelming," the sisters said in a statement. "This is the saddest day of our lives."
And in Henderson, Tennessee, Johnny Cash was buried today, a private service. Many notables were on hand, the singer and songwriter/actor Kris Kristofferson saying that Mr. Cash represented the best in America.
Ahead on NEWSNIGHT: the horror of Stephen King getting a prestigious literary reward. And some are outraged. Imagine that. Jeff Greenfield puts it in perspective.
We take a break first. This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: OK, now here's tonight's NEWSNIGHT quiz. What's the difference between popular literature and classic literature? If you answer that someone who writes popular literature is much richer than someone who writes classic literature, you get an A. You get extra credit for adding that most people who write classic literature are dead before anyone realizes it's classic, all of which is by way of getting over to the controversy of a literary award that's being given to Stephen King, who is probably the most successful popular writer of all time.
Here is Jeff Greenfield.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN SR. ANALYST: He writes books faster than most of us can read them, some 50 of them by now. And they sell like hotcakes did before the Atkins diet caught on. He passed the 100 million mark a decade ago. And from "Carrie..."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "THE SHINING")
JACK NICHOLSON, ACTOR: Here's Johnny.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GREENFIELD: To "The Shining" to "The Green Mile" and beyond, they've been turned into movies and miniseries for more than a quarter century. There is no doubt that, if you measure writers by their output or by their popular appeal, Stephen King is at the very top of the list.
But when the National Book Foundation announced that King would be honored for his contribution to American letters this fall, the same award given in the past to literary lions like Philip Roth and John Updike, some writers and critics recoiled. "He writes what's used to called penny dreadfuls," fumed Yale professor and critic Harold Bloom. "This award," he said of the foundation, "is testimony to their own idiocy."
(on camera): Now, granted, a lot of the most popular writers of fiction today are deservedly destined for obscurity. And I suppose it is tough to credit a writer with literary stature when he revels in ghosts and monsters, as well as in scaring us out of our wits in general.
On the other hand, it does seem true throughout history for elites to scorn the most popular writers of their time, to assume that, if a lot of people like you, you can't possibly be all that good. And that is a truly idiotic assumption.
(voice-over): For instance, this piece of fiction starts out with a ghost. It's called "Hamlet," written by a fellow named Shakespeare. And when Mary Wollstonecraft Shelley wanted to paint a cautionary tale about the dangers of meddling with powerful forces, she did it with a story about a monster, Frankenstein.
But more instructive is how frequently the critics of the past scornfully dismiss writers whose reputations look pretty good today. "His place in French literature will be neither considerable nor high," one critic wrote. He wrote that of Balzac. "Vulgar in tone, sterile in artistic invention, without genius, wit or knowledge of the world." So Ralph Waldo Emerson wrote of Jane Austen.
"The only consolation, which we have in reflecting upon it, is that it will never be generally read," wrote one critic of Emily Bronte's "Wuthering Heights." "I have always believed his verses would soon rank with forgotten things." That was what John Quincy Adams said of Lord Byron.
(on camera): Now, the uncharitable view here is that some in the literary world simply can't stand the idea that someone who writes so prolifically, who is read so widely, and who is so incredibly rich could also be destined for immortality. It's as if the captain of the high school football team was also a straight-A student.
But remember Aristotle's definition of tragedy, a catharsis of emotion through pity and terror. When it comes to evoking those emotions, it's hard to think of a more consistent performer than Stephen King. On the other hand, maybe he's a lousy typist.
Jeff Greenfield, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Popular and a modern-day classic, morning papers after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(ROOSTER CROWING)
BROWN: Wonder if our new boss is going to allow us to keep the rooster.
Time to check morning papers from around the country and around the world. We'll start with "The New York Times." Why not? It's on top. "Chicago's Vote Delayed By" -- Chicago? Just read what's written there, Aaron. The boss would like that, too. "California's Vote Delayed by Court Over Punch Cards." And a very cool picture of the hurricane. I don't know how well you can see that, taken from space. "As Hurricane Nears, Disaster Plans Go Into Effect," a lot of concern here in the New York area.
So it's almost a local story on the front page of "The New York Times." Imagine that. Well, I shouldn't say that. I'll get in trouble.
"The Boston Herald." That's an even -- well, I don't know if it's a better picture, but it's a different picture of the hurricane. "Uh-Oh" is the headline. "Eastern U.S. Braces for Isabel." It's going to dominate the news over the next several days.
"The Detroit News." The president was in the Detroit area today. And so "Bush" -- that would be the president -- "Links Clean Air Rules to Jobs. The President Uses Trip to Michigan to Tout Environmental Record." I don't know how big an issue the environment will be in the election, but the president trying to get a leg up on an issue that has bedeviled him. I don't know that I use the word bedevil very often. I wanted to use it there.
"San Francisco Chronicle." "Recall Monkey Wrench" is the "San Francisco Chronicle" headline. "Campaigns in Turmoil After Vote Delayed, Appeal to U.S. Supreme Court Likely." I'm actually still a bit confused about that. "Bush vs. Gore Redo." I wanted to use that word, too.
How we doing on time?
"Oregonian" out in Portland, Oregon. "Judges Stalls California Recall Vote." You know about that already. They put Chief Moose right there on the front page because he used to be the police chief in Portland, Oregon, was for a long time. "Moose's Preference For Privacy Still Intact," promoting his book. And they did an interview with him. And that's "The Oregonian."
The weather tomorrow in Chicago, for those of you who keep track of such things, is spiffy. Really?
We're back tomorrow, 10:00 Eastern time. We know you will be, too. Or, at least, we hope that.
Until then, good night for all of us at NEWSNIGHT.
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