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to the President's lawyers on December the 5th?

A. Much later, as in last year.

Q. Okay. Yes--that's what I mean--later.

A. I, I mean--

Q. Yes.

A. --post this investigation.

Q. Okay. All right. Let's go forward another week or so to December the 11th and a lunch that you had with Vernon Jordan, I believe, in his office.

A. Yes.

Q. How did--how was that meeting set up.

A. Through his secretary.

Q. Did you instigate that, or did he call through his secretary?

A. I don't remember.

Q. What was the purpose of that meeting?

A. Uh, it was to discuss my job situation.

Q. And what, what--how was that discussed?

A. Uh, Mr. Jordan gave me a list of three names and suggested that I contact these people in a letter that I should cc him on, and that's what I did.

Q. Did he ask you to copy him on the letters that you sent out?

A. Yes.

Q. During this meeting, did he make any comments about your status as a friend of the President?

A. Yes.

Q. What--what did he say?

A. In one of his remarks, he said something about me being a friend of the President.

Q. And did you respond?

A. Yes.

Q. How?

A. I said that I didn't, uh--I think I--my grand jury testimony, I know I talked about this, so it's probably more accurate. My memory right now is I said something about, uh, seeing him more as, uh, a man than as a President, and I treated him accordingly.

Q. Did you express your frustration to Mr. Jordan with, uh, with the President?

A. I expressed that sometimes I had frustrations with him, yes.

Q. And what was his response to you about, uh--after you talked about the President?

A. Uh, he sort of jokingly said to me, You know what your problem is, and don't deny it--you're in love with him. But it was a sort of light-hearted nature.

Q. Did you--did you have a response to that?

A. I probably blushed or giggled or something.

Q. Do you still have feelings for the President?

A. I have mixed feelings.

Q. What, uh--maybe you could tell us a little bit more about what those mixed feelings are.

A. I think what you need to know is that my grand jury testimony is truthful irrespective of whatever those mixed feelings are in my testimony today.

Q. I know in your grand jury you mentioned some of your feelings that you felt after he spoke publicly about the relationship, but let me ask you more about the positive--you said there were mixed feelings. What about--do you still, uh, respect the President, still admire the President?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you still appreciate what he is doing for this country as the President?

A. Yes.

Q. Sometime back in December of 1997, in the morning of December the 17th, did you receive a call from the President?

A. Yes.

Q. What was the purpose of that call? What did you talk about?

A. It was threefold--first, to tell me that Ms. Currie's brother had been killed in a car accident; second, to tell me that my name was on a witness list for the Paula Jones case; and thirdly, he mentioned the Christmas present he had for me.

Q. This telephone call was somewhere in the early morning hours of 2 o'clock to 2:30.

A. Correct.

Q. Did it surprise you that he called you so late?

A. No.

Q. Was this your first notice of your name being on the Paula Jones witness list?

A. Yes.

Q. I realize he, he commented about some other things, but I do want to focus on the witness list.

A. Okay.

Q. Did he say anything to you about how he felt concerning this witness list?

A. He said it broke his heart that, well, that my name was on the witness list. Can I take a break, please? I'm sorry.

SENATOR DeWINE: Sure, sure. We'll take a 5-minute break at this point.

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: This marks the end of Videotape Number 1 in the deposition of Monica S. Lewinsky. We are going off the record at 10:56 a.m. [Recess.]

THE VIDEOGRAPHER: This marks the beginning of Videotape Number 2 in the deposition of Monica S. Lewinsky. The time is 11:10 a.m.

SENATOR DeWINE: We are now back on the record. I will advise the House Managers that they have used one hour and 8 minutes. Mr. Bryant, you may proceed.

MR. BRYANT: Thank you. By MR. BRYANT:

Q. Did--did we get your response? We were talking about the discussion you were having with the President over the telephone, early morning of the December 17th phone call, and he had, uh, mentioned that it broke his heart that you were on that list.

A. Correct.

Q. And I think you were about to comment on that further, and then you need a break.

A. No.

Q. No.

A. I just wanted to be able to focus--I know this is an important date, so I felt I need a few moments to be able to focus on it.

Q. And you're comfortable now with that, with your--you are ready to talk about that?

A. Comfortable, I don't know, but I'm ready to talk about.

Q. Well, I mean comfortable that you can focus on it.

A. Yes, sir.

Q. Good. Now, with this discussion of the fact that your name appeared as a witness, had you--had you been asleep that night when the phone rang?

A. Yes.

Q. So were you wide awake by this point? It's the President calling you, so I guess you're--you wake up.

A. I wouldn't say wide awake.

Q. He expressed to you that your name--you know, again, you talked about some other things--but he told you your name was on the list.

A. Correct.

Q. What was your reaction to that?

A. I was scared.

Q. What other discussion did you have in regard to the fact that your name was on the list? You were scared; he was disappointed, or it broke his heart. What other discussion did you have?

A. Uh, I believe he said that, uh--and these are not necessarily direct quotes, but to the best of my memory, that he said something about that, uh, just because my name was on the list didn't necessarily mean I'd be subpoenaed; and at some point, I asked him what I should do if I received a subpoena. He said I should, uh, I should let Ms. Currie know. Uh--

Q. Did he say anything about an affidavit?

A. Yes.

Q. What did he say?

A. He said that, uh, that I could possibly file an affidavit if I--if I were subpoenaed, that I could possibly file an affidavit maybe to avoid being deposed.

Q. How did he tell you you would avoid being deposed by filing an affidavit?

A. I don't think he did.

Q. You just accepted that statement?

A. [Nodding head.]

Q. Yes?

A. Yes, yes. Sorry.

Q. Are you, uh--strike that. Did he make any representation to you about what you could say in that affidavit or--

A. No.

Q. What did you understand you would be saying in that affidavit to avoid testifying?

A. Uh, I believe I've testified to this in the grand jury. To the best of my recollection, it was, uh--to my mind came-- it was a range of things. I mean, it could either be, uh, something innocuous or could go as far as having to deny the relationship. Not being a lawyer nor having gone to law school, I thought it could be anything.

Q. Did he at that point suggest one version or the other version?

A. No. I didn't even mention that, so there, there wasn't a further discussion--there was no discussion of what would be in an affidavit.

Q. When you say, uh, it would be--it could have been something where the relationship was denied, what was your thinking at that point?

A. I--I--I think I don't understand what you're asking me. I'm sorry.

Q. Well, based on prior relations with the President, the concocted stories and those things like that, did this come to mind? Was there some discussion about that, or did it come to your mind about these stories--the cover stories?

A. Not in connection with the--not in connection with the affidavit.

Q. How would--was there any discussion of how you would accomplish preparing or filing an affidavit at that point?

A. No.

Q. Why--why didn't you want to testify? Why would not you-- why would you have wanted to avoid testifying?

A. First of all, I thought it was nobody's business. Second of all, I didn't want to have anything to do with Paula Jones or her case. And--I guess those two reasons.

Q. You--you have already mentioned that you were not a lawyer and you had not been to law school, those kinds of things. Did, uh, did you understand when you--the potential legal problems that you could have caused yourself by allowing a false affidavit to be filed with the court, in a court proceeding?

A. During what time--I mean--I--can you be--I'm sorry--

Q. At this point, I may ask it again at later points, but the night of the telephone--

A. Are you--are you still referring to December 17th?

Q. The night of the phone call, he's suggesting you could file an affidavit. Did you appreciate the implications of filing a false affidavit with the court?

A. I don't think I necessarily thought at that point it would have to be false, so, no, probably not. I don't--I don't remember having any thoughts like that, so I imagine I would remember something like that, and I don't, but--

Q. Did you know what an affidavit was?

A. Sort of.

Q. Of course, you're talking at that time by telephone to the President, and he's--and

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Friday, February 5, 1999

• Defense, prosecution plot best use of videotapes
• Transcript highlights from the witness depositions
• Bipartisan group moves to open Senate deliberations
• Straw poll focuses attention on potential women candidates
• Secret Service concerned over Chelsea Clinton cover story
• GOP told to develop post-impeachment message
• Starr lawyers discuss impeachment
• President to establish race relations office
• Is Chelsea Clinton a valid journalistic subject?

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