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Two Republicans, two points of view
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Resisting pressure from the White House, the Senate voted late Thursday to make Iraq pay back half of roughly $20 billion in reconstruction funds. The House rejected the loan requirement in its version of the bill, and the two measures must be reconciled before President Bush can sign the legislation. CNN's Bill Hemmer spoke with Sen. Saxby Chambliss of Georgia, one of eight Republicans who supported the loan provision and Sen. Richard Shelby, R-Alabama, an opponent of the loan amendment. The following is an edited transcript: HEMMER: Two Republicans, different sides of this view. Senator Chambliss, why do you believe that you broke ranks with the White House on this amendment last night? CHAMBLISS: Well, Bill, my position on this has been very firm since the very first day that the president said he wanted to send a package over here. I felt all along like, number one, we ought to support our troops. I never wavered on giving the money for the troops unconditionally. But on the part that goes into rebuilding the infrastructure of Iraq, I've always felt like that the Iraqi people ought to have some ownership of assets that are within their country. If they have some ownership of it, they're going to help us fend off terrorist attacks against the rebuilding process and plus they'll look after it a little bit better once it's in place. So I've strongly supported it and the provision that we had gives the president the opportunity to have the debt forgiven. I think it was a win-win on both sides. HEMMER: What's wrong with that, Senator Shelby? Why did you go against it? SHELBY: Well, I thought it would be best to support the president and support the president's aims, period, here, because at the end of the day, I doubt if this makes it through the House-Senate conference. But even if it did, I don't know how the Iraqi people would pay the loan back. You know, France never paid their loans back. England never paid their loans back. Russia never paid their loans back. But what I think we should keep our eye on the ball here, and that is to get the Iraqi people going, get the country on a firm footing. And that's what the president's message was and I support the president on this. HEMMER: Senator... SHELBY: Now, would I like... HEMMER: Go ahead. SHELBY: ... for the Iraqi people to pay everything? Absolutely, you know. But they're not in a condition to ... Now, there are some caveats tied to this provision, this loan provision, and Senator Chambliss could explain those in detail. But -- and I'm sure he would. But it's conditioned upon other -- you know, the forgiveness of the big debt. Iraq is a debtor nation big time, mainly to France and to Russia. What we need to do is get rid of those debts and then maybe see if Iraq, the modern Iraq can pay some loans back, including us. HEMMER: Yes, Senator Shelby, the debt you talk about is estimated at about $120 billion that Iraq owes countries around the world. Some estimates put it much higher, maybe $150 billion, even higher. Back to Senator Chambliss, though, you sponsored this amendment last night. The concern is this, on behalf of the White House. You go to Madrid next week, you try and recruit all this money at the donors conference from money around the world. Does it send the wrong message when you're telling other countries, well, give the money, but only if you give it back. CHAMBLISS: Well, you look at who the major creditors are. You've got Saudi Arabia. You've got Kuwait. You've got France, Germany and Russia and Japan. The president has the opportunity to go to those countries and say look, when it comes to Middle Eastern countries that are creditors, you're the major beneficiaries of this. We have removed a tyrant, a murderer and a terrorist from power in your part of the world. We need now for you to come in, after the sacrifice that we've made, after the financial commitment that we've made, we're going to spend some $170 billion between now and the end of next year in their part of the world. We're simply asking them to forgive a small part of that. If they do, we forgive ours. You look at France, Germany and Russia, what do they stand to gain out of this? They're probably never going to be repaid their money anyway. But they have an opportunity now to participate in the process. We have made all the sacrifices, financially as well as losing 332 American men and women who fought so bravely over there on this war on terrorism. They didn't lose one single life. All we're asking them to do is forgive significantly less money than what we're going to be owed.
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